11:34:27 tichure : hey sammy. letting folks wander in 11:38:18 Taylor : Good morning everyone! 11:38:51 tichure : hey now 11:39:04 tichure : we will start in a couple minutes 11:39:15 Taylor : Ok thank you 11:40:40 tichure : So hey folks, have you been making decisions on your term paper topic 11:40:56 Taylor : yes 11:41:09 tichure : and… It is…… 11:41:51 tichure : Atulya, Sammy, did you make a decision on your term paper topic 11:42:26 Taylor : Well my movie is One flew over the cuckoos nest 11:42:36 tichure : and how is your research coming along Taylor 11:42:43 tichure : for the annotated work cited 11:42:52 Taylor : And I have found many different angles that I can talk about for my paper 11:42:58 tichure : excellent 11:43:14 Atulya : i was going to do it on the character analysis for Norman bates. Im right no trying to find interviews and sources related to the movie 11:43:18 Sammy : yes my mov is the graduate 11:43:23 Taylor : I haven’t started my works cited, but I am going to start it tonight 11:43:25 tichure : will remember you only need to to begin with, but finding things that give you ideas for the four of them is also very good 11:43:59 Sammy : mo it id the graduate film 11:44:17 Atulya : im doing pschyo 11:44:49 tichure : and how is your process going in terms of gathering research material 11:45:08 tichure : by way, so far these are all good choices. One of the benefits of doing an older movie is that it has had time to be analyzed in more than one generation, which is going to be helpful 11:45:52 Atulya : my topic is going to be about the anlsyis of Norman bate's mental illness 11:46:04 Atulya : i m trying to find sources where professionals 11:46:14 tichure : well you’re doing a movie Atuluya, and you’re going to be covering two different translations on your first paper and for translations total 11:46:26 tichure : and so what you’re talking about is a cultural criticism from psychologists who would then diagnose the character 11:46:30 tichure : which is one translation 11:47:00 tichure : and we will be talking about the difference between a psychoanalytical criticism, which is a literary device, and a psychological analysis, which is a psychological device 11:47:19 tichure : They are different. They both have value, but they are different 11:47:23 tichure : and we will talk about that as well 11:47:48 tichure : today we discussed breathless, were going to apply different ways to translate the work, showing you how you can change the focus in order to change the translation and the meaning of the work 11:48:10 tichure : by the way, I use Dragon speak. It doesn’t always type what I want it to say 11:48:22 tichure : so if anything seems gibberish, ask me 11:48:47 tichure : so in general, let’s get the plot out of the way 11:48:54 tichure : so what’s the basic plot of breathless? 11:49:19 Taylor : A French man killed a police officer and is on the run 11:49:28 tichure : Yes 11:49:37 tichure : that’s the first set up 11:49:40 tichure : and then 11:50:25 Taylor : Then he meets up with his girlfriend?/lover and tries to find odd ways to get money to live without getting caught by police or recognized by society 11:50:25 Atulya : then he uses patricia to protect himself and escape from the crime 11:50:43 tichure : you both correct and you both 11:50:50 tichure : are giving us a different view of the same action 11:50:52 tichure : which is excellent 11:50:57 tichure : so 11:51:05 tichure : do you think we're supposed to like this character? 11:51:22 Taylor : And she tries not to love him because she wants to be a successful journalist but is also pregnant with his baby 11:51:29 Taylor : No we aren’t 11:51:34 tichure : Not asking if you like the character. I’m asking you if you think the director wanted us to like the character 11:51:45 tichure : why not Taylor 11:51:58 Atulya : no i think the director wanted us to have sympathy for the character 11:52:13 Atulya : tbh it was hard to figure what the director wanted cause throughout the story 11:52:22 Atulya : he tried to potray different shades of the character 11:52:28 Logan : No. I think the director doesn't want us to like Michel. 11:52:34 Taylor : No I think the director wanted him to seem like a cold character because in that mafia kind of lifestyle, the men are emotionless and have to have this hard exterior to deal with the crimes they commit 11:53:02 Logan : The story makes it hard to gain sympathy for him. 11:53:04 tichure : interesting Atulya.. what makes the character empathetic 11:53:35 tichure : Logan, why not 11:53:48 tichure : who did the character want to be 11:53:59 tichure : or what did the character want to be 11:54:14 tichure : Taylor, is this guy really as hard and unaffected by others as he wants to Appear 11:54:55 Atulya : in the beginning of the story he is portayed into a negative shade. as the story goes with his relationship with Patricia. the director tries to bring the other side of him. when he was killed at the end it was supposed to bring upon the diea 11:54:57 Atulya : idea 11:55:12 Taylor : Yes I think he really just likes to look out for himself. He would throw her under the bus to save himself any day. 11:55:16 Atulya : if it was right thatif he was shot 11:55:21 Taylor : He shows that several times 11:55:23 Taylor : Especially the way he comes off with this player persona towards the girl he “loves”, when really he just wants her to fulfill his sexual desires. She secretly knows that and thats why I think she gives him up in the end. She knows that no matter how hard she tries to change him, he will always choose himself over anyone. 11:55:58 Logan : It's hard to gain sympathy for him because everything that has happened to him, has been a direct cause of a previous action. He did kill the police officer, and is constantly shown to be very selfish. He claims to care about Patricia, but only wants to use her for her body. 11:55:58 tichure : will certainly in the overall, he seems self-serving, but did we get glimpses of any vulnerability 11:56:19 tichure : any sense that perhaps he is more insecure than he is self-assured 11:56:20 Taylor : Yes at the very end when he is on the floor 11:56:32 tichure : any sense that the act is necessary because he is actually weaker than everyone else 11:56:41 tichure : any sense that he does not like himself anymore than we do 11:56:45 Atulya : I feel the main reason that they audience did not like him is because of his selfish motive . i felt that the director wanted us to feel symapathy for him at the end when he dies 11:57:00 Atulya : i still disagree and am not saying that he is a good person 11:57:11 tichure : Atulya, that means we would have to develop some kind of empathy or understanding the character before that happens. Otherwise, we like to see bad people die 11:57:19 tichure : we like to see bad people be dispatched. 11:57:42 tichure : That’s why we get all these revenge movies where the good guys put upon over and over and over again and eventually Jason Statham or Keanu Reeves or whoever turns bad ass and goes out and beats the crap out of everybody or kills them 11:57:44 Taylor : I think he is insecure in the way she doesn’t completely swoon over him. He is used to getting his way with the women, so the way she makes him fight for her is almost like a challenge because he is so used to getting whatever woman he wants whenever he wants 11:57:53 tichure : and this is an old trope 11:58:22 tichure : it does seem that way Taylor, but based on the conversations he’s having with other people, this seems to be a common theme at the time 11:58:28 Atulya : well since in this case micheal was the protagonist/ anti hero right? because the conflict builds because of him. So the director wanted us to have to debate in our minds was it right 11:58:40 tichure : in what era is this film set 11:58:42 Atulya : that if he should have died 11:58:45 Taylor : 1920s? 11:58:53 tichure : no 11:59:03 Atulya : 50s or 60s? 11:59:07 Atulya : or 40? 11:59:17 Sammy : I think the film set in the 1940 50s 11:59:17 Taylor : 30s? 11:59:21 tichure : late 50’s 11:59:27 tichure : post war 11:59:37 tichure : influenced by Americans 11:59:42 Logan : It seemed like the 50s-60s to me. 11:59:49 tichure : did you notice his attention to automobiles 11:59:54 tichure : what kinds of cars was he stealing 12:00:05 Taylor : Fords? 12:00:09 Logan : They were American Fords. 12:00:16 tichure : well the Cadillac is American also 12:00:21 tichure : as was the Buick at first 12:00:24 tichure : so you’re on the right track 12:00:28 tichure : their American cars 12:00:47 tichure : is there anything else American that he seemed to be enamored with 12:01:06 Taylor : The girl 12:01:09 tichure : of course 12:01:18 tichure : something else 12:01:21 tichure : someone else 12:01:51 Taylor : Im drawing a blank 12:01:57 Taylor : I can’t remember 12:02:17 tichure : why did he keep rubbing his lip 12:02:35 tichure : this is something that he did throughout the movie and she did at the end of the movie 12:02:48 tichure : drawing the thumb across the lower lip 12:03:10 Logan : He's based his whole personality on Humphrey Bogart 12:03:12 tichure : yes 12:03:15 tichure : very good Logan 12:03:28 tichure : what does he think about French automobiles 12:03:57 tichure : what does he think about France or the French experience 12:04:02 Taylor : They aren’t as timeless as American cars 12:04:13 tichure : that’s part of it 12:04:19 tichure : which ones are faster more powerful 12:04:25 tichure : which ones are built better 12:04:29 Taylor : He thinks France is boring and that there is so much to experience everywhere else in the world 12:04:36 Taylor : American 12:04:40 Sammy : American 12:04:45 Logan : American 12:04:47 tichure : what happened to France in World War II 12:04:58 Taylor : They were taken over right? 12:05:00 Logan : It became occupied by the Nazis 12:05:02 tichure : yes 12:05:03 tichure : yes 12:05:06 tichure : give me another word 12:05:13 tichure : a word that would apply to how men specifically feel 12:05:24 Logan : Trapped? 12:05:29 Taylor : Surrendered to the nazis 12:05:39 tichure : Taylor you’re on the right track 12:05:47 Taylor : Conquered? 12:05:54 tichure : keep going 12:05:58 tichure : make it more gender specific 12:06:03 tichure : make it more assault on the man 12:06:09 Sammy : occupied by germany and why French did not see any to growth and became failiure 12:06:18 tichure : make it more humiliating 12:06:28 tichure : for man 12:06:32 Taylor : They were overthrown? 12:06:33 tichure : a man 12:06:40 tichure : they were indeed 12:06:54 tichure : are they still controlled by the Nazi regime 12:06:59 Taylor : no 12:07:01 Logan : No 12:07:04 tichure : what happened 12:07:16 Taylor : American won against nazi germany 12:07:24 tichure : well it wasn’t just the Americans. 12:07:27 Taylor : america** 12:07:30 tichure : The Russians were fighting from the other side 12:07:32 tichure : but 12:07:35 Taylor : And england 12:07:36 tichure : who liberated France specifically 12:07:45 Taylor : And Russia I think? 12:07:53 tichure : that is correct Taylor those were the big three 12:07:57 tichure : but who liberated France specifically 12:08:01 tichure : of those three 12:08:09 Taylor : England? 12:08:21 tichure : interestingly, there been several movies lately about this 12:08:36 tichure : England was part of it but they were not the main force 12:08:43 tichure : they didn’t have the materials and they did not have the manpower 12:09:03 tichure : which of course leaves 12:09:06 tichure : us 12:09:14 tichure : how do you think that made French men feel 12:09:20 Taylor : Humiliated 12:09:22 tichure : and there would be two main feelings 12:09:24 tichure : yes 12:09:27 tichure : but also 12:09:30 Taylor : relief 12:09:35 Taylor : Anger? 12:09:35 tichure : well something more than that 12:09:47 Taylor : Helplessness? 12:09:49 tichure : hold onto that One Taylor 12:09:51 Sammy : Frustrated 12:10:07 tichure : think of a positive response 12:10:12 tichure : toward your liberators 12:10:18 tichure : you have the negative responses 12:10:20 Taylor : GRATITUDE 12:10:21 tichure : so now tell me 12:10:23 tichure : the positive responses such 12:10:25 tichure : stronger 12:10:33 Taylor : appreciation 12:10:34 tichure : you don’t just want to thank them 12:10:38 tichure : you want to 12:10:42 Taylor : envious 12:10:45 tichure : keep going 12:10:47 Taylor : Be them 12:10:50 tichure : yes 12:10:52 tichure : yes indeed 12:11:03 Logan : So imitation? 12:11:07 Taylor : yes 12:11:09 tichure : look at our main character 12:11:19 Taylor : He is envious of being american 12:11:23 tichure : why do you think he would pick Humphrey Bogart 12:11:26 tichure : yes 12:11:30 tichure : so why Bogart 12:12:01 Taylor : He is a strong American hustler known in cinema 12:12:05 Taylor : He makes money 12:12:10 Taylor : Gets all the women he wants 12:12:14 tichure : Hustler is an interesting word 12:12:19 tichure : I’m not sure how familiar you are with Bogart’s work, 12:12:32 tichure : but he had two basic characters 12:12:40 tichure : at the beginning of his career, he was one find and then 12:12:44 tichure : especially after Casablanca 12:12:47 tichure : he became another kind 12:13:01 tichure : but both of these fit our main character 12:13:08 tichure : anybody familiar with Bogart? 12:13:13 Taylor : nope 12:13:14 tichure : Because if not, I’ll just tell you 12:13:27 tichure : anybody 12:13:28 tichure : anybody 12:13:33 Taylor : Investigator? 12:13:34 tichure : Buehler 12:13:43 tichure : that’s right 12:13:47 tichure : Sam Spade 12:13:55 tichure : well the early part of his career he was gangster 12:13:55 Taylor : gangster 12:14:01 tichure : and then he became an underdog 12:14:08 tichure : and a romantic figure 12:14:11 tichure : still a test guy 12:14:14 tichure : still a tough guy 12:14:16 Taylor : Steam boat captain 12:14:18 tichure : but tough guy with a heart 12:14:20 tichure : for the right girl 12:14:24 tichure : that would be the African Queen 12:14:31 tichure : very late in his career 12:14:48 Taylor : Night club owner Rick Blaine 12:14:50 tichure : so let’s look at our main character again 12:14:53 tichure : Casablanca 12:15:04 tichure : what aspects of the Bogart character is he embodying 12:15:22 Taylor : He wants to find love like he has? 12:15:27 tichure : that would be part of it 12:15:48 Taylor : ohhh 12:15:51 Taylor : I get it 12:16:10 tichure : remember in real life, Humphrey Bogart met Lauren Bacall when she was 19 and he was I believe was twice her age 4 to have and have not 12:16:31 tichure : but he often played this roguish character 12:16:36 tichure : who was a tough guy 12:16:40 tichure : and antiestablishment 12:16:42 tichure : but also 12:16:47 tichure : could be romantic 12:16:49 tichure : lover 12:16:51 tichure : etc. 12:17:12 tichure : that reveal tells us already that he does not like himself 12:17:19 tichure : that he wants to be someone else 12:17:39 tichure : and once we understand that, while his behavior might be atrocious, we begin to get a little empathy because we realize that this person is insecure 12:17:57 tichure : his comments about other people have a lot to do with whether or not they accept him 12:18:10 tichure : any times does he insult the women around him, specifically his American girlfriend 12:18:14 tichure : how many times 12:18:25 tichure : and what are the conditions in which he does that 12:18:46 Taylor : He is also insecure once he saw that Patricia/“Ingrid” was being sought after by another man 12:18:56 Atulya : hes also a parnoid 12:18:58 Atulya : person 12:19:06 Atulya : i feel that he has a sort of mental disorder 12:19:15 Taylor : He insults her and then turns to smoking and always says how tired he is 12:19:28 Taylor : Could this be a form of depression? 12:19:43 Atulya : maybe anxiety 12:20:06 Logan : He definitely seemed to have anxiety 12:20:07 tichure : very good Taylor 12:20:14 tichure : will this is something 12:20:19 tichure : I want you to try not to do 12:20:24 tichure : and that is to psychoanalyze the character 12:20:32 tichure : within the context of giving him some kind of tendency or malady 12:21:17 Taylor : ok 12:21:18 tichure : and instead look at what the director is saying about the French experience and reaction to war World War II and whether or not it was helpful or unhelpful, healthy or unhealthy for the French culture, in this case man because that’s who were really focusing on in the story 12:21:36 tichure : because if we simply say that he’s depressed or neurotic, the conversations over 12:21:53 tichure : but if we realize that the director is trying to tell a story in a particular way to reflect what’s going on in the world at the time, we get a much more complex story 12:22:03 tichure : and it also opens doors up for more translations 12:22:10 tichure : did anybody do any research on the director 12:22:16 Taylor : no 12:22:18 tichure : and either his style or his motives or anything like that 12:22:19 Atulya : no 12:22:25 tichure : Logan, Sammy? 12:22:34 Logan : No, I hadn't. 12:22:40 Sammy : no 12:22:44 tichure : Okay so here’s the deal 12:22:49 tichure : for both the movie that you’re doing 12:23:03 tichure : and then the movies that you watch the class, I want you to get a little bit of information about the director because it can help you to understand what the directors doing 12:23:07 tichure : in terms of storyline 12:23:11 tichure : the way the movies cut 12:23:16 tichure : the way the characters are behaving 12:23:18 tichure : the choice of actors 12:23:20 tichure : the settings 12:23:22 tichure : etc. 12:23:39 Taylor : ok 12:23:42 tichure : all which affect us in terms of our understanding of what were watching and what it’s supposed to mean from their perspective 12:23:52 Atulya : if we do our reaserch topic as a pschyoanalysis how should it be. like you mentioned you do not want us to give a term just because the character is suffering 12:23:56 Atulya : internally 12:23:59 tichure : Marxist criticism is a critical perspective that is planes the directors intention, which includes all the things that I just mentioned 12:24:11 tichure : hold on Atulya.. we will get there 12:24:25 tichure : but one of things I want you to do is start with the basics before you get to the complex and psychoanalytical criticism is complex 12:24:36 tichure : whereas getting a director to talk to their movie and explain what they were doing sometimes very basic 12:24:59 tichure : in this case, this director is part of what was called the French new wave 12:25:13 tichure : the French new wave was the type of cinema that has been incredibly influential on modern movies, MTV videos and the like 12:25:23 tichure : did you notice anything about the way that scenes played 12:25:30 tichure : did they seem smooth or jumpy 12:25:41 Taylor : jumpy 12:25:49 tichure : why 12:26:06 Atulya : is the French new wave likethe britsh new wave 12:26:18 Taylor : Because he wanted to get all the different angels of the scene 12:26:21 Atulya : like back then where the briitsh or rock abnds in the uk were growing 12:26:25 tichure : no Atulya 12:26:26 Taylor : angles** 12:26:36 tichure : that was the 70s 12:26:51 tichure : well that’s part of it Taylor 12:27:05 tichure : but also part of this approach was to try to have a certain level of realism while at the same time reminding the audience that they’re watching a movie 12:27:10 tichure : hence the references to movies 12:27:12 tichure : including Bogart 12:27:29 tichure : so instead of having a guy sit down for a couple coffee putting the cream and sugar and stir it and then lift the cup to his lips, 12:27:39 tichure : they would simply have a guy sit down at the table and suddenly he has the coffee cup in his hand 12:27:47 tichure : and of course we realize that the guy sat down and poured himself a cup of coffee 12:27:53 tichure : and it moves the action along more quickly 12:28:06 tichure : and so you get a lot of jump cuts 12:28:14 tichure : that may seem like their mistakes 12:28:18 tichure : she has a mirror in her hand 12:28:23 tichure : and then she has no mirror in her hand 12:28:55 tichure : and the idea was to move the story along as quickly as possible, taking into account that the audience is going to fill in what the director considers to be unnecessary action in order to get to the part that’s important, which is the conversation and the actions that are necessary for the storyline 12:29:11 tichure : so we see him pull the gun out of the car 12:29:17 tichure : and then we see the police officer falling back into the bushes 12:29:24 tichure : we know what happened 12:29:34 tichure : also, they use natural lighting 12:29:41 tichure : and they’re not on a set 12:29:43 Taylor : I noticed that 12:29:47 tichure : when they’re in the room, you can hear the street below 12:29:58 Taylor : You could tell when it was starting to get dark 12:29:58 tichure : and when they’re walking on the street, I don’t know if you noticed, but the passersby kept turning around to watch the action 12:30:05 tichure : yes indeed 12:30:10 Taylor : And they got scenes in real traffic 12:30:26 tichure : this type of cinema was a mixture of a gritty realism and a reflection that this is a movie. A reminder that this is a movie 12:30:28 tichure : indeed they did 12:30:36 tichure : and look all people standing around watching the action 12:30:51 tichure : but you also have a reflection of postwar France 12:30:56 tichure : relatively high unemployment 12:31:01 tichure : lot crime 12:31:04 tichure : lot of petty crime 12:31:12 tichure : and the presence of Americans 12:31:23 tichure : how was the American economy doing at the time? 12:31:58 Taylor : Booming right? 12:32:03 tichure : Yes 12:32:09 tichure : so what do we do with our money 12:32:15 Taylor : Because all of the other countries were damaged from war 12:32:20 Taylor : drinking 12:32:22 Taylor : smoking 12:32:23 tichure : that is correct 12:32:27 Taylor : Throwing parties 12:32:35 tichure : something that affected other countries 12:32:41 tichure : because we can drink and smoke and throw parties in America 12:33:15 Taylor : While they were trying to recover from damages and lost lives 12:33:31 tichure : why would an American go to live in France 12:33:44 tichure : or Spain 12:33:50 tichure : or England 12:34:26 Taylor : They appreciated/ envied Americans out there so they would give them jobs? 12:34:36 tichure : how strong is the French Franc or the British pound or the Spanish Paseta 12:34:45 tichure : not exactly 12:34:52 Taylor : Not as much as an American dollar 12:34:56 tichure : remember, there is a lot of unemployment in these countries in time because much of the industry was destroyed 12:35:05 tichure : that is correct. So what are we doing with our American dollars besides partying it up 12:35:17 Taylor : Spending it on goods 12:35:24 tichure : as a reflection of our main female character 12:35:29 Taylor : Because their value for their currency went down 12:35:37 tichure : folks, why is the girl in France 12:35:47 Taylor : To become a better journalist 12:35:59 tichure : why people still go to Mexico 12:36:03 tichure : Americans 12:36:05 tichure : tourists 12:36:07 tichure : why Mexico 12:36:13 Taylor : freedom 12:36:24 Taylor : partying 12:36:24 tichure : it’s not that high-minded Taylor 12:36:29 tichure : keep going 12:36:36 Taylor : Having fun 12:36:42 tichure : why party in Tijuana when you can party in San Diego 12:36:46 Taylor : An escape maybe 12:37:05 Taylor : Drugs and alcohol is so much cheaper 12:37:07 tichure : you know there became a term known throughout the world as the ugly American 12:37:14 Taylor : I heard from a friend... 12:37:15 tichure : you finally nailed it 12:37:16 Sammy : mexico is exotic to american 12:37:33 tichure : Sammy , Mexico is cheap to Americans 12:37:48 tichure : the American dollar goes a long way in many countries even today but post- World War II, the American dollar went a long way everywhere 12:37:51 tichure : so we traveled 12:37:52 Taylor : What do you mean the ugly American 12:38:14 Taylor : ohhh 12:38:15 Taylor : ok 12:38:16 tichure : you’ll probably want to research on it it is relevant to your work, basically this is a tourist who has money 12:38:22 tichure : and is visiting some of the country 12:38:25 Taylor : That makes sense 12:38:40 tichure : filled with poor helpless shmucks 12:38:46 tichure : who will do anything for our fancy dollars 12:38:50 tichure : who can be ordered around 12:38:54 tichure : who can be used and discarded 12:38:58 tichure : because were rich 12:39:01 tichure : and they’re not 12:39:08 tichure : suddenly a middle-class person feels like a Rockefeller 12:39:17 tichure : so they act like jerks 12:39:27 tichure : how do you think that makes people in that country feel 12:39:35 Logan : They feel used 12:39:35 Taylor : worthless 12:39:36 tichure : especially the men 12:39:52 Taylor : powerless 12:39:59 tichure : yes 12:39:59 Taylor : Like a servant 12:40:05 tichure : and those other words you gave me earlier 12:40:07 tichure : emotional words 12:40:11 tichure : negative things 12:40:32 tichure : what do the downtrodden and disenfranchised in this country do in order to feel better 12:40:44 Taylor : Party 12:40:48 tichure : that’s one thing 12:40:50 Taylor : Drink alcohol 12:40:53 Taylor : Do drugs 12:40:55 tichure : that’s the same thing 12:41:09 tichure : how do you get back at the fat cats 12:41:10 Taylor : Take advantage of those higher up than then 12:41:14 Taylor : them* 12:41:15 tichure : how do you make yourself feel more like a fat cat 12:41:19 tichure : by doing what 12:41:27 Taylor : Eat? 12:41:28 tichure : if they drive a nice car 12:41:36 Taylor : Drive a nicer car 12:41:44 tichure : where are you going to get that Taylor 12:41:45 Taylor : Try to one up the competition 12:41:48 tichure : remember, your poor 12:42:17 Taylor : Get into illegal activity? 12:42:23 tichure : exactly 12:42:30 Taylor : Like drug trade or mafia life 12:42:43 tichure : one of the interesting things of note is that during riots, when people are looting stores, they are often going for luxury items 12:42:49 tichure : they’re not stealing bread and cheese and all that stuff 12:42:59 tichure : theyre stealing 60 inch televisions 12:43:20 tichure : and it doesn’t matter about race. This has to do socioeconomic status 12:43:26 Logan : They want things to enhance their lifestyle rather than the necessities. 12:43:26 tichure : feeling like you’re not missing out 12:43:31 tichure : that is correct 12:43:35 tichure : so go back to your main character 12:43:51 tichure : what kinds of cars is he stealing. Are these just transportation or are these actually a symbol of 12:43:55 tichure : power 12:43:58 tichure : prestige 12:44:00 tichure : status 12:44:01 Taylor : American nice cars 12:44:04 tichure : yes 12:44:14 tichure : a Cadillac 12:44:14 Logan : They're items of luxury 12:44:17 tichure : a T Bird 12:44:20 tichure : a Buick eight 12:44:30 Atulya : good cars . i feel that he wants the American dream. 12:44:37 tichure : that is actually correct 12:44:45 tichure : and where did he see that American dream 12:44:49 tichure : how does he know what the American dream is 12:44:52 Taylor : The girl 12:44:55 tichure : how does he know what America looks like or what people do 12:44:55 Taylor : television 12:44:57 Taylor : media 12:44:58 Logan : In the movies. 12:45:05 tichure : Logan you got it 12:45:20 tichure : BOGART 12:45:47 tichure : the director is showing us the disenfranchised youth as a result of being invaded and then rescued during the war 12:45:52 tichure : and these are not people who fought the war 12:45:56 tichure : this is late 50s early 60s 12:46:01 tichure : these were children during the war 12:46:23 tichure : it is their parents who suffered the most but also were most likely to make some kind of sense out of it and try to get back to work 12:46:26 tichure : but the youth 12:46:34 tichure : they were scarred 12:46:38 tichure : think about it. 12:46:46 tichure : One of the elements that Americans were given as part of their rations were American cigarettes 12:46:49 tichure : and candy bars 12:46:52 tichure : Hershey candy bars 12:46:55 tichure : hundred percent American 12:47:02 tichure : they were supposed to share the cigarettes with locals 12:47:08 tichure : and their supposed to share the candy with the children 12:47:14 tichure : because it is excellent propaganda 12:47:17 tichure : we are the good guys 12:47:20 tichure : we are the nice guys 12:47:24 tichure : we are the ones who provide 12:47:38 tichure : and this was happening all across Europe 12:47:50 tichure : the result was a generation that felt fragmented 12:47:59 tichure : how can the be proud to be French if they saw their parents humiliated 12:48:06 tichure : but not quite American either 12:48:18 tichure : so what does this guy do to build his self-esteem 12:48:23 tichure : to be less French 12:48:26 tichure : less loser French 12:48:28 tichure : and more American 12:48:32 tichure : more successful American 12:48:37 Taylor : Steal stuff to gain back more power 12:48:40 tichure : if you look at his specific choices they all become very clear 12:48:46 tichure : anything Taylor? Stealing anything 12:48:48 Taylor : Sell the cars that are American 12:48:49 tichure : or 12:48:50 tichure : yes 12:48:52 tichure : and 12:49:24 Logan : By imitating a famous American actor. 12:49:41 tichure : in the United States, we are so comparable, we are not only sending women to college now, but also racial and that the minorities to college. We want everyone to have an education. And of course if you’re doing well, we’ll send you to college overseas 12:49:54 tichure : Logan, it’s actually more the specifics. It is interesting that there are certain American things that he rejects 12:50:19 tichure : she offers him Chesterfield cigarettes but he sticks with those almost cigar like Galoises 12:50:28 tichure : my spelling may be a little bit off on that 12:50:37 Taylor : Like how the girls parents send her money for college 12:50:51 tichure : but he goes after the American girlfriend and you’re right he does take the American car in an American gangster style 12:50:53 tichure : yes 12:51:02 tichure : he has a few pennies 12:51:05 tichure : well a few centimes 12:51:08 tichure : in his pocket 12:51:13 tichure : while she says that if she leaves the Sorbonne 12:51:19 tichure : it’s like you saying if I leave Harvard 12:51:26 tichure : her father will cut her off from her allowance 12:51:40 tichure : how does that make you feel as a French man 12:51:46 tichure : how you feel in relation to her 12:51:52 Taylor : Like you are worthless to her 12:51:56 tichure : and what is the way that you can make yourself feel better in relation to her 12:51:58 tichure : exactly 12:52:03 tichure : and what is the way to make yourself feel better 12:52:07 tichure : in relation to her 12:52:18 Taylor : To get more money so you seem more worthy to her 12:52:21 tichure : are you going to make enough money 12:52:25 Taylor : nope 12:52:26 tichure : is he ever going to make enough money 12:52:29 tichure : so that’s not it 12:52:33 Taylor : Probably not 12:52:34 tichure : whether value does she have 12:52:39 tichure : what other value does she have 12:52:47 Taylor : Being a good journalist 12:52:55 tichure : does he care about that 12:53:04 Taylor : Having a good relationship with someone who is serious about her 12:53:15 tichure : go back to your original analysis of him 12:53:22 Taylor : He is selfish? 12:53:23 tichure : does he want a good relationship 12:53:25 tichure : of course 12:53:27 Taylor : no 12:53:29 Atulya : no 12:53:31 tichure : how does he make himself feel better about this woman 12:53:35 Taylor : sex 12:53:38 tichure : how does he make himself feel better about his status compared hers 12:53:39 tichure : yes 12:53:44 tichure : because in that culture 12:53:47 tichure : and certainly in American culture 12:54:05 tichure : sex means 12:54:09 Taylor : love 12:54:15 tichure : did you see love 12:54:17 Taylor : desire 12:54:19 Taylor : no 12:54:27 Atulya : american culure values physical ascepts ina relationship 12:54:48 tichure : well every culture values the physical aspects Atulya..the question is what value 12:55:06 tichure : why is it so important for him to have sex with her 12:55:11 Taylor : Being wanted 12:55:14 tichure : isn’t he already having sex with other people 12:55:20 Taylor : yes 12:55:22 tichure : what happened to France during World War II 12:55:29 Taylor : He wants someone to lust after him 12:55:34 Taylor : They were conquered 12:55:35 tichure : give me a word of what happened to France during World War II 12:55:37 tichure : very good 12:55:42 tichure : so how do you feel good about being conquered 12:55:46 tichure : how do you make that up 12:55:49 tichure : how do you make it better 12:55:56 Taylor : You conquer someone else 12:55:59 tichure : there you go 12:56:04 tichure : you get the sense that he loves this woman ? 12:56:11 Taylor : no 12:56:12 tichure : you get the sense that he’s looking for some kind of meaningful relationship ? 12:56:18 Taylor : But he wants to conquer her 12:56:19 Atulya : not really 12:56:20 tichure : , was she willing to have sex with him 12:56:23 Taylor : yes 12:56:29 tichure : but 12:56:32 tichure : what did she say 12:56:32 Atulya : he just wants to be dominant in the relationship 12:56:35 tichure : what was holding her back 12:56:38 tichure : that is correct Atulya 12:56:41 tichure : but what was holding her back 12:56:47 Taylor : Her career 12:56:51 Taylor : Her pregnancy 12:56:59 Taylor : His lack of responsibility 12:57:03 tichure : Was she a prude?Was she having sex with other people 12:57:12 Taylor : Yes? 12:57:15 tichure : of course 12:57:18 tichure : she counted them off 12:57:27 tichure : what did she tell him she was concerned about 12:57:27 Taylor : But she wasn’t as fond of them as she was of him 12:57:33 tichure : fond 12:57:35 tichure : not love 12:57:37 tichure : fond 12:57:41 tichure : this is postwar Europe 12:57:51 tichure : what happened to sex during World War II 12:58:00 Taylor : Not happening that much 12:58:07 Taylor : Men were off at war 12:58:11 tichure : Taylor, Taylor, Taylor 12:58:48 tichure : let’s do a little history 12:59:00 Taylor : ok 12:59:01 tichure : historical criticism is a critical perspective that explains the context of an environment that is being portrayed in your story 12:59:03 tichure : it basically explains the culture 12:59:16 tichure : and it’s important you understand that if you were to explain to me French culture that is going on in this movie you are not doing a cultural criticism 12:59:19 tichure : you’re doing historical criticism 12:59:26 tichure : cultural criticism is something else and will get to that later 12:59:53 tichure : especially in America, during the 1930s, as a result of the sexual freedom of the 1920s and the ensuing depression sexual mores became more and more conservative 13:00:03 tichure : however, war creates chaos and uncertainty 13:00:17 tichure : and of course if you are in America in the 1930s and your boyfriend or girlfriend says hey 13:00:25 tichure : let’s have sex, your answer would likely be what 13:00:40 tichure : what would be required in order for that act to occur 13:00:45 Taylor : marriage 13:00:50 tichure : yes 13:00:52 tichure : now 13:00:54 tichure : it’s wartime 13:00:59 tichure : boyfriend is going away 13:01:01 tichure : to war 13:01:07 tichure : to war that already has high casualties 13:01:11 tichure : now what’s the answer 13:01:17 Taylor : yes 13:01:20 tichure : of course why 13:01:29 Atulya : because theres a chance he might die 13:01:32 Taylor : Because he might not come back 13:01:33 Atulya : and never come back 13:01:37 tichure : yes 13:01:47 tichure : then you’re french 13:01:55 tichure : Nazis invade 13:02:10 tichure : now what is the situation 13:02:33 tichure : and this happened in China and Korea with the Japanese 13:02:40 Taylor : Have sex because you might die from the nazis conquering? 13:02:42 tichure : in Germany with the Russians 13:02:50 tichure : is a little bit worse than that Taylor 13:02:54 Taylor : So lots of women get pregnant aka Baby Boomers 13:03:00 tichure : that happened after the war 13:03:03 tichure : that’s after the war 13:03:19 tichure : boomers start 44-45 13:03:23 tichure : this is during the war 13:03:28 tichure : what is the value of women during the war 13:03:31 tichure : if you’re the invading army 13:03:36 Taylor : ohhh 13:03:39 tichure : yes 13:03:40 Taylor : Women might get rape 13:03:44 Taylor : raped** 13:03:44 tichure : and how the men feel about their women 13:03:47 tichure : exactly 13:03:50 Taylor : protective 13:03:58 tichure : that bird has flown Taylor 13:04:05 tichure : you can’t stop the Army 13:04:07 Taylor : oop 13:04:10 tichure : there to kill you 13:04:16 tichure : unless your female 13:04:22 Taylor : So they will rape and kill them 13:04:28 Taylor : Or just rape them 13:04:29 tichure : not necessarily 13:04:32 tichure : exactly 13:04:44 Taylor : Use them as sexual prisoners of war? 13:04:45 tichure : the Japanese were notorious for creating “comfort” women for their troops 13:04:48 tichure : you got it 13:05:11 tichure : so how are you feeling now as a French man 13:05:20 tichure : and of course when the Americans came into the country 13:05:25 tichure : and understand they’re coming from a very prudish country 13:05:31 tichure : to the sexually liberated Europe 13:05:34 tichure : and everybody knows about 13:05:37 tichure : French girls 13:05:45 Taylor : They are open to having sex with all the French women 13:05:47 tichure : then who are the French girls having sex with 13:05:54 tichure : because all French women are having sex with the Americans 13:05:54 Taylor : everyone 13:06:05 tichure : it is an aspect of war that changes sexual mores 13:06:12 tichure : now what happened in the United States is after the war, people came home 13:06:14 tichure : got married 13:06:16 tichure : had a bunch kids 13:06:18 tichure : baby boomers 13:06:21 tichure : but we have money 13:06:23 tichure : infrastructure 13:06:25 tichure : new technology 13:06:27 tichure : automobiles 13:06:29 tichure : jobs 13:06:49 tichure : during the World War II era, the country went from an agrarian society to a technological society. People moved from the sticks to the cities. They went out in the world and came back sophisticated 13:06:59 tichure : during the war, Chevy and Ford and Chrysler and Lincoln made 13:07:02 tichure : Jeeps 13:07:04 tichure : tanks 13:07:13 tichure : and then they started making cars again 13:07:22 tichure : while Europe is still trying to sift through the rubble 13:07:42 tichure : historical criticism help you to understand the context of the work in a way to better understand what characters act and feel the way they do 13:07:46 Taylor : America is rising 13:07:55 tichure : as well as to understand what the directors trying to do because the director knows that history. That’s why they’re portraying it. They’re showing you their version of that world 13:07:57 tichure : we were at the top 13:08:10 tichure : unlike our allies, England and Russia, we had no damage on American soil 13:08:19 tichure : Hawaii was not the state at the time 13:08:34 tichure : and now we have this French guy 13:08:37 tichure : who grew up in this environment 13:08:41 tichure : who feels lost 13:08:47 tichure : doesn’t want to identify with losers 13:08:49 tichure : weaklings 13:08:54 tichure : he looks for an identity 13:08:58 tichure : in this context 13:09:07 tichure : if you’re going to Marxist criticism, you would probably include historical information 13:09:20 tichure : whereas historical criticism is simply going to explain what’s going on without making any reference to what the director wants to do with that information 13:09:32 tichure : and likelier historical criticism is going to dive deep into all the elements that you see 13:09:43 tichure : then you would with Marxist criticism, which is also to focus on the making of the movie, the choice of actors etc. 13:09:53 tichure : so you can see how these two critical perspectives are related 13:09:57 tichure : but they are going to be different 13:10:17 tichure : there will be some information that is shared but when you give me historical context in your Marxist criticism, it comes back to what the director thinks about it and wants to say about it in the movie 13:10:27 tichure : whereas historical criticism does not give us any opinion. It simply tells us what happened 13:10:33 tichure : we do not talk about what’s sad or good 13:10:38 tichure : moral or immoral 13:10:40 tichure : right or wrong 13:10:44 tichure : it simply reports 13:10:47 tichure : no editorial 13:10:53 tichure : the Marxist criticism is giving us the editorial of the director 13:11:07 tichure : and the director is saying because all the stuff was happening, our youth is going off the rails 13:11:17 tichure : and we have this character who needs to feel in power 13:11:22 tichure : so he takes what he wants 13:11:30 tichure : scams who he can 13:11:40 tichure : and what better emblem of status 13:11:50 tichure : than this bourgeoisie girlfriend 13:11:53 tichure : American girlfriend 13:12:03 tichure : are you with me so far 13:12:20 Taylor : yes 13:12:26 Logan : Yes, that makes sense 13:12:42 tichure : one of the things that I want you to have in your annotated work cited is information about the director and if you can find more than one source that discusses the directors approach to material, the general themes that the director uses, and of course interview with the director, you have the material for Marxist criticism focusing on the director’s intention 13:12:55 tichure : there is another kind of Marxist criticism and that has to do with class struggle, but we can talk about that next time 13:13:02 tichure : because I just realized class should’ve been over 10 minutes ago 13:13:05 tichure : I’m sorry to keep you 13:13:19 tichure : on Weds, we can talk about your material and weaken try a couple more critical respect is with this particular movie 13:13:25 tichure : but I’m supposed to be in another class in four minutes 13:13:36 tichure : if you have a chance, maybe do a little research or even watch the movie again 13:13:39 tichure : or even scenes 13:13:44 tichure : just to get a feel for what we were talking about 13:13:54 Taylor : Ok thank you so much professor 13:14:00 Taylor : Have a great day 13:14:13 tichure : by the way folks, it was not Swayze who remade this 13:14:17 tichure : it was Gere 13:14:26 tichure : but we will burn that bridge Wednesday 13:14:30 Taylor : ok 13:14:31 tichure : have a great day everybody 13:14:34 tichure : see you Wednesday 13:14:36 Atulya : see ya 13:14:40 Logan : Thank you! Have a great day. 13:14:47 tichure : poof