13:38:52 tichure : hey Daniel 13:39:00 Daniel : hi Mr. Eiland!!! 13:39:03 tichure : how can i help you 13:39:14 Daniel : I though more of my classmates would come but anyways 13:39:36 tichure : most pop in and ask a question and then head outy 13:40:03 tichure : hows the paper coming along 13:41:28 Daniel : so I wanted to make sure I was getting these responses poems together cause boy has it been a RIDE, so for the second one, I did Marie Howe’s Practicing and you said after I submitted the first time to identify the historical perspective and make it clear that you are identifying it. So what I did for the first sentence of the body paragraph 13:42:11 tichure : “From an Historical perspective” always works 13:42:27 Daniel : P.S. I’m learning a lot more about immigration issues than I learned before, I need to still get some more info on the author to see if I can add any biographical ibfo 13:42:55 Daniel : anyways, I said, “From a historical perspective, instances like the one Howe explains in her poem, have been a hindrance to the LGBTQ+ community for generations. “ 13:43:00 Daniel : is this good enough? 13:43:06 tichure : yes 13:43:11 tichure : dead on 13:43:24 tichure : i just need to know the argument 13:43:30 tichure : it makes it easier to follow 13:43:53 Daniel : thanks, so what do you mean by the argument, if I can ask? 13:44:43 tichure : you may ask 13:44:52 Daniel : ty lol 13:45:25 tichure : an argument is not a disagreement. 13:46:01 tichure : In this context, the argument is the claim that you’re making 13:46:08 tichure : so each critical perspective is a separate argument 13:46:20 Daniel : ok, that helps, so would I state the argument as I would state the perspective, dead on? 13:46:23 tichure : this is the way the term “argument is used in law and in debate 13:46:31 tichure : well your argument is this perspective 13:46:46 tichure : so your argument for the Marxist perspective is that the author believes XYZ 13:46:55 tichure : your argument for the historical perspective is that such and such happened 13:47:10 tichure : when you get into the response based critical perspectives such as feminist and culture in such 13:47:13 tichure : and such 13:47:23 Daniel : oohhh ok, so it’s from the authors POV? 13:47:38 tichure : your argument is going to be what that particular group or or belief system thinks about the work you are analyzing 13:47:43 tichure : will not specifically the authors 13:47:59 tichure : words, the word “argument” has to do with establishing a case 13:48:13 tichure : so from a Marxist perspective for Pat Mora’s poem 13:48:29 tichure : your argument is that she believes that the border patrol is aggressive and abusive 13:48:40 tichure : and your evidence is the information that you find about her beliefs and politics 13:48:46 tichure : so your evidence supports your argument 13:49:04 tichure : this all has to do with logic and structure of making one’s case 13:49:08 tichure : or stating one’s opinion 13:49:22 tichure : if you take a philosophy class, a law class or debate class, you would see the term argument used in this context 13:49:47 tichure : so the argument that you make for feminist criticism is going to be explaining what the feminist thinks of the poem based on their beliefs 13:50:01Daniel : oh ok wow you really know how to break something down thanks a lot 13:50:04 tichure : but argument that you make for a cultural criticism is going to be what that particular ethnicity or religion or political group thinks of the poem based on their beliefs 13:50:30 tichure : well I do what I can 13:50:45 tichure : a lot of the terminology that you see in a class like this you often see in your other classes 13:50:55 tichure : and that includes feminist criticism, Marxist criticism 13:50:58 tichure : critical theory 13:51:01 tichure : thesis 13:51:03 tichure : argument 13:51:04 tichure : proof 13:51:07 tichure : evidence 13:51:09 tichure : etc. 13:51:26 tichure : and after a while it just becomes part of your knowledge base 13:51:42 tichure : so when you read that fancy cocktail party, you can just toss around all these terms and everything 13:51:49 tichure : and then have to explain them to people who didn’t take these classes 13:51:50Daniel : so for example, like Marie Howe’s poem Practicing, I would say from a Historical perspective Marie Howe believes that? 13:51:56 tichure : no 13:52:30 tichure : Historical criticism is a critical perspective that is objective 13:52:46 tichure : it doesn’t express an opinion about the poem 13:52:49Daniel : ooh ok so it’s Marxist? 13:52:53 tichure : it explains what the realities were at the time 13:53:00 tichure : Marxist criticism is the one that explains her opinion exactly 13:53:14 tichure : any time you use the phrase “the author wanted to say” you are doing Marxist criticism 13:53:50Daniel : ok so then I would say from a Marxist perspective Marie Howe believes 13:53:56 tichure : historical criticism just establishes the realities. Now you will use historical information in order to explain Marxist criticism because the author is living in that world but the difference between historical and Marxist is that your analysis for Marxist is giving us the authors reaction to those realities where as historical just states the facts 13:54:02 tichure : here’s an example 13:54:06 tichure : what is going on with practicing 13:54:20 tichure : what are these girls doing, where are they doing it why are they doing it in that way 13:56:03Daniel : ok so they are having sex, in a basement, 13:56:43Daniel : and.....they’re doing it in that way because they don’t want to get caught? 13:56:46 tichure : why in the basement 13:56:51 tichure : yes 13:56:58 tichure : and who are they afraid is going to catch them 13:57:06Daniel : their parents 13:57:19 tichure : do they talk about it outside of the basement 13:57:28Daniel : not at all 13:57:42 tichure : why not and the answer is also why their parents would not be happy if they found out about it 13:57:54 tichure : what is the culture in which they live 13:58:01 tichure : and what values does a culture hold 13:58:06 tichure : concerning this particular behavior 13:59:13Daniel : they live in a society that wouldn’t accept a same sex relationship 13:59:23 tichure : this is where your information about the author is helpful 13:59:27 tichure : you have to be more specific 13:59:38 tichure : because it’s more than same-sex relationships that are problem here 13:59:40 tichure : in fact 13:59:59 tichure : why are these girls having sex with each other? Why aren’t they having sex with boys? Are they lesbians 14:00:25Daniel : no, the titles says their just practicing, might it be about experiencing sexual desire 14:00:32 tichure : practicing for what 14:00:41 tichure : practicing for whom 14:00:51Daniel : good question ?? 14:00:54 tichure : sexual desire implies the notion that they’re doing this together because they want to do this together 14:01:07 tichure : practicing implies that they are going through a behavior in order to be better at it when it comes time for the real deal 14:01:11 tichure : so which one is it 14:01:14 tichure : according to the poem 14:01:24 tichure : with no information about the author you can basically have an answer to the question 14:01:44Daniel : puberty? 14:01:44 tichure : but if you know about the author and her upbringing it becomes a lot clearer as to what they are doing and why 14:02:01 tichure : what do to the girls say to each other 14:05:09Daniel : ......they’re practicing right? 14:05:22 tichure : when you do the research on the author, you want to not only find out in what environment (religion/culture/region of the United States) she was raised, but you’re also going to need to find an article in which she is interviewed in which she explains not only why she wrote this, but the experience that she had upon visiting one of the girls from the basement, who had the magazine in which this poem was published sitting on the coffee table. These two women sat there and had a pleasant conversation but they never brought up the poem or the issue. That’s how strong that taboo is in that culture 14:05:31 tichure : practicing for whom 14:05:34 tichure : practicing for what 14:05:55 tichure : that’s why I asked you what do the girls actually say to each other; some few dialogue bits in this poem 14:06:16 tichure : are they practicing so that they are better lovers for women 14:07:25Daniel : oh so they can be better wives when having sex 14:07:30 tichure : yes 14:07:38 tichure : why don’t they practice with boys 14:07:40Daniel : I saw the part where it said now you be the boy 14:07:44 tichure : yes 14:07:53 tichure : why don’t they practice with boys 14:08:01Daniel : because they weren’t paired with them 14:08:18 tichure : this is why you need to know what the culture is of the author because as soon as you know that, everything else’s explained 14:08:22 tichure : as long as you know what the culture believes 14:08:30 tichure : there are no boys in the basement 14:08:38 tichure : they are not paired with them because of the belief system 14:08:45 tichure : the same belief system that says what they’re doing is also wrong 14:09:03 tichure : but a belief system but also, strangely, believes that the women and men, without any “practicing” should somehow be adept at sex 14:09:14 tichure : so do your research 14:09:28 tichure : and it’ll become clear as to where the authors coming from and why even today some of those same girls will never talk about this issue 14:09:42 tichure : also, that research will explain why the author decided to come out about this. It’s something that happened to her family personally 14:09:55 tichure : and really the poem is more about a reaction to the negative effects of silence about sexuality 14:10:06 tichure : than it is about her experiences with other girls 14:10:19Daniel : I guess I need to do some reconstructing of my response poem 14:10:29 tichure : well but a lot of it has to do with finding the proper research 14:10:56 tichure : because as soon as you have the right information this poem is crystal clear as to what the author’s trying to say and your Marxist criticism becomes Straightforward 14:11:02 tichure : look man I’m here till 230 14:11:15 tichure : go look up this author and her issues and what’s happening in this particular poem 14:11:23Daniel : ok will do 14:11:25 tichure : you’ll find it in Gale and/or Ebscohost resources 14:11:45 tichure : and then pop back in and you will find the conversation is a lot easier because you have the material that you need to make the argument as to what the author was going for in this poem 14:11:49 tichure : what she’s trying to say to culture 14:11:53 tichure : and what she saying about culture 14:11:56 tichure : and what it does to people 14:11:56Daniel : thanks a lot 14:12:06Daniel : I’ll be right back 14:12:09 tichure : you got it 14:12:19 tichure : I’ll be here 14:18:55 Daniel : Hellur I’m back 14:19:01 tichure : so how did it go 14:19:12 tichure : what culture did she get raised in 14:19:34 Daniel : so I’m having a problem with the Ebscohost and Gale , am I search her name up ? 14:19:42 tichure : her name 14:19:52 Daniel : Cause when I do, it’s says no resources found 14:20:06 tichure : are you still incorrectly 14:20:16 tichure : spelling it correctly 14:20:26 Daniel : Marie Howe right? 14:20:29 tichure : by way 14:20:31 tichure : yes 14:20:56 tichure : by the way, sometimes you take the first name out it can help 14:21:31 Daniel : ok 14:21:41 tichure : also 14:22:01 tichure : I want you to do a Google search looking for YouTube videos with the author 14:22:16 Daniel : ok, that can help 14:22:20 tichure : , she might read it to you 14:22:49 tichure : and in Google searches, you are not looking for grade saver or other K-12 garbage 14:23:10 Daniel : if I have anymore problems with the research I’ll just email you 14:23:15 tichure : you are looking for articles in magazines like salon, the New Yorker etc. 14:23:17 tichure : for sure 14:23:20 Daniel : WILL DO! 14:23:40 tichure : and I know the material is out there because we have done this poem for semesters now 14:23:49 tichure : and you’ll find what you’re looking for 14:24:05 Daniel : thanks Mr. Eiland this really helps, see y’a later 14:24:06 tichure : also we have 103 chat tomorrow at the same time 14:24:14 tichure : and 7 to 9 Wednesday evening 14:24:20Daniel : ok I’ll see if I can make it 14:42:13 tichure : poof