- You joined the Main Room. ( 7:03 PM ) - - Your chat permission has been enabled. ( 7:03 PM ) - tichure 7:29 PM h - rebecca213 1 joined the Main Room. ( 7:39 PM ) - tichure 7:32 PM Hey there Rebecca. How can I help you 7:32 PM how's your paper coming along? 7:32 PM rebecca213 1 7:33 PM hi! it it's going okay i just have a few questions 7:33 PM tichure 7:33 PM Of course please go ahead rebecca213 1 7:34 PM I'm still struggling a bit between the feminist approach and androcentric approach for the movie It tichure 7:34 PM in what way obviously, because they would have different viewpoints, you could do both 7:34 PM as long as you find the requisite information required to apply both. 7:35 PM rebecca213 1 7:36 PM I was planning on analyzing the only female character in the perspective of the androcentric by explaining that she only survived due to her "masculine" characterisitcs and qualities tichure 7:36 PM Very good. What would they think about the treatment of women by the males in the story? rebecca213 1 7:37 PM They wouldn't like how the women were treated in the story but feminist wouldn't like it as well, which is where I'm struggling because I need an approach that opposes it right? 7:37 PM tichure 7:38 PM It depends. There may be some crossover. What would they say about the male characters themselves? Which ones do they prefer and which ones would they find less appealing? rebecca213 1 7:40 PM Feminists would say that the male characters are sexist due to the various comments made on the character's gende when you say they you mean feminist correct? 7:41 PM tichure 7:41 PM Of course. More importantly, remember that feminist criticism, like any cultural criticism, requires two elements. The first is whether or not they agree that the events in the story happened, and in these cases it is a generalized discussion as to whether or not women or treated by men and by other women the way as is portrayed in the movie. Actually I meant the androcentric view in terms of how they would feel about the male characters, but it's both that are important here because this is where the divergence may occur. 7:41 PM like feminist criticism, androcentric criticism also requires that you identify whether they would agree that things occur as presented in the work. 7:42 PM This is where they may disagree. 7:42 PM The woman will say that women are treated this way all the time. The men will likely say that this is an extreme example of a rare occurrence as if it happens all the time. 7:42 PM This is commonly an androcentric response to a work that may be perceived as feminist. What women or feminist writers portray as everyday occurrence is perceived by the accused as painting everyone with the same broad brush. Men often do not see their actions as sexist. If they behave in the same fashion, they perceive it is flirting or as invited or as funny. 7:43 PM Of course, if someone were to act the same way to their daughter or their girlfriend, they might have a different view. It's the nature of perspective. 7:44 PM rebecca213 1 7:44 PM I never thought of that! Thank you for clarifying tichure 7:44 PM This is where you would be well served to find articles that discuss the different ways that men and women view the same situation. You can then use the responses from the two sides for each one of your arguments that are going to be separately presented in your paper. Sociologists, especially feminist sociologist, but anyone involved in gender studies, is often intrigued and explores the difference between the way that men and women will view the exact same situation. The so-called "he said/she said" conundrum is so pervasive that there are books and articles and even television shows and movies based on this very same construct. 7:45 PM That means there will be material out there which will discuss the issues, not your movie, but the issues brought up by the movie in which you will have commentary from both the feminist and the androcentric perspective. Very often, you may find the to different viewpoints in the same document, as that is the researchers' point and position. 7:45 PM rebecca213 1 7:47 PM Okay. So for my paper, I could explain the different ways men and women view the treatment of the female character in the movie? Also, if I do this, wouldn't the time period be relevant? Does that mean I'd use another approach? 7:48 PM tichure 7:48 PM That's why asked you how they would feel about individual male characters. Androcentric critics often claim that the emasculation of male characters is often a standard trope of feminist or feminist affected writers, men included. The "sensitive New Age guy" who seems to understand the woman's feelings and is less concerned about getting laid is often portrayed in a more positive way than the more aggressive testosterone driven guy who sees women as an object to be conquered. In the androcentric view, sex is a game that is played by women and therefore no doesn't always mean no. It's more about playing hard to get. Whether or not either side is actually correct is never going to be resolved. However, it is these perspectives about relationships and the interactions between men and women that create these two sides, which of course is why we have much of the conflict in terms of gender going on in our culture even today. Time. It is absolutely relevant. 7:48 PM You must place the work within the context of the critical analysis. 7:48 PM I would suggest that you translate the work from the modern feminist and the modern androcentric views. 7:48 PM Again, I need to clarify that these are going to be your two critical perspectives. 7:48 PM Each one of them will be in its own paragraph. 7:48 PM Neither one of them will discuss the other. 7:49 PM rebecca213 1 7:49 PM Yes those two will be my perspectives tichure 7:49 PM You are simply translating the movie in one paragraph entirely from androcentric perspective about who they like and who they don't like and whether they agree that what is portrayed actually occurs and whether or not they think that their gender is being portrayed accurately. Furthermore, they're going to comment on whether or not the author editorial… The way the characters are portrayed by the director, is something that they would agree with. You might as well go with the latest feminist arguments that you can find, as well as the latest male centered comments that you can find. Whether you find something that is focused solely on male belief or it is couched within a more organized structure, such as a religion that is patriarchal, is up to you. 7:50 PM There's something else to consider here as well 7:50 PM if you are doing third or fourth wave feminist criticism, they are not only concerned with gender equality. They are concerned with racial and other social quality. In the original book, one of the child characters is African-American and part of his struggles is the fact that he is Antagonized because of his race. Secondly feminist would not be concerned about that, but a third or fourth wave feminist would note that inequality, as they are concerned about the quality for everyone, not just women. 7:51 PM Likewise, you may even find that your androcentric view is narrowed down to a culture or religious viewpoint that takes race into account in a way that would either champion one race over the other or not. That is up to you. 7:52 PM Because so many religions and cultures themselves are male centered, you may find more material by choosing one and going to their resource material in terms of their beliefs and or to formulate a solid, focused argument from that viewpoint. 7:53 PM Very often, those cultures may also harbor very strong feelings about racial superiority as well as gender superiority. 7:53 PM rebecca213 1 7:54 PM Interesting. I'm going to think about narrowing the androcentric view You really helped me! I think I'm good for now. 7:56 PM tichure 7:57 PM Well the reason you would narrow the androcentric view is because, unlike feminist criticism, androcentric perspective is the establishment that feminist criticism was created as a result of, in the same way that African-American studies and LatinX studies, among others, were created as a result of the predominance of white cultural bias in literature and literary analysis. That means there's not really an androcentric perspective unless you want to broad brush every guy who writes as androcentric, which would be false. 7:57 PM However, there are specific cultural and religious groups that do adhere to the patriarchy as or to any other choice. Certainly most conservative religions tend to be patriarchal, with diminished roles and subservient roles for women, and in some cases for people who do not fit the ethnic or cultural ideal within that group. By the way, not all of these prefer white people over nonwhite people. It depends on religion and the culture. Choosing a specific focal group will affect the way that you translate the work. 7:58 PM A conservative Latino religion is going to be looking for positive portrayals of men but also of Catholicism and Latinos. 7:59 PM Those in African-American political action groups, such the Black Panthers, are looking for cultural bias that shows superiority for black men. 7:59 PM The KKK is going to not only be positive toward Christian religion, but hostile toward any religion that they seem as anti-Christian, including Catholics, Jews and other groups that might be considered by other people as Christian. Obviously, they also have a very distinct racial bias. 8:00 PM The benefit of any one of those that I just mentioned is that they are very clear about their viewpoints which makes it a lot easier to use as source material for writing a paper. 8:00 PM Choose one that you think has enough of a viewpoint about the various issues presented in the story that they would have something to say about what happens in the story. It does not have to be 100% in opposition to feminist translation. It just needs to be predominantly different and obviously you will be using different resources if you go down that road. 8:01 PM rebecca213 1 8:02 PM Okay. Thank you so much for clarifying. If I find more sources, do I have to create another annotated works cited? tichure 8:03 PM no 8:04 PM the annotated works cited was created by you in order to demonstrate to yourself and to me that you have enough basic material to write a paper. What you actually end up with on your paper may be simply a portion of, a modification of, or a largely different version of what you turned in as your annotated work cited. 8:04 PM It is unlikely you will turn in a paper that uses all 10 of those resources. It is far more likely that you will use some of them and you will find a few others in the course of writing your paper. 8:05 PM By the way, I forgot to ask. Which version of the movie are you doing? 8:05 PM rebecca213 1 8:06 PM the 2017 version and the first draft? 8:06 PM tichure 8:07 PM Okay. Obviously it is going to have some different tonal qualities from not only the book, which was written in the 70s, but the movie which was made in the same approximate era, especially because of the fundamental nature of the difference of what was considered "normal" or "acceptable" treatment of women and people of color between then and now. a first draft is the one that includes your introduction, the two body paragraphs, and the conclusion. It only has two critical perspectives. 8:07 PM I will grade that for you and then get it back to you and you will have one chance to revise it before you then add two more critical perspectives to create a total of four for the final paper due at the end of the semester. 8:07 PM But it is a completed work, as best as you can do in terms of research and application of the critical perspectives. 8:08 PM rebecca213 1 8:10 PM Okay. I understand now! Thank you rebecca213 1 8:23 PM Okay. I understand. Thank you tichure 8:23 PM You got it. Have a good evening. - rebecca213 1 left the Main Room. ( 8:32 PM ) - tichure 8:25 PM poof