s10all422s2000 has joined the conference. redhedhuff has joined the conference. s10all422s2000: hey hey hey redhedhuff: Hello stichure: hey now stichure: papers...what's hapnin s10all422s2000: haha dang its been crazy round here! s10all422s2000: i just got back from AZ redhedhuff: working on my outline s10all422s2000: and leave for texas this next week s10all422s2000: I've been sifting secondary sources and trying to play catch up s10all422s2000: i just got a promotion, today was my first day as my new title! stichure: whooohooo s10all422s2000: ok, i'm trying to get all 10 done stichure: beers are on mike redhedhuff: congrats! and so we call you.. s10all422s2000: LOL stichure: mr 2000 s10all422s2000: more responsibility, never more pay haha s10all422s2000: a little more but you know redhedhuff: if you got m ore money, it might go to your head! stichure: the added headaches....priceless stichure: yeah stichure: then you wouldnt wantto hang with us anymore zoochikk has joined the conference. s10all422s2000: naw i might have you again for 103 LOL zoochikk: hello stichure: hey now zoo s10all422s2000: if all goes well!!!! redhedhuff: will your title elevate to 4000? zoochikk: Hello Professor s10all422s2000: hey zoo stichure: great redhedhuff: hi zoo stichure: or atleast 2001? stichure: got yer notecards, zoo zoochikk: hi red and 2000 s10all422s2000: LOL how ive missed u guys! zoochikk: are they ok redhedhuff: yeah, we da cool group stichure: be careful with those deep crits..those are 103 level stichure: rest are fine zoochikk: did you get my stressed out message i left ya Professor? stichure: al you need is 5-7 stichure: ypou sent 13 s10all422s2000: deep crits? stichure: feminst crit stichure: psychoanalytical zoochikk: haha stichure: deconstruction stichure: thats 103 s10all422s2000: zoochikk: i am crazy in this class s10all422s2000: redhedhuff: I saved all my work from that class! I need to go look through it again! zoochikk: I threw in a little extra credit stichure: No problem... he should be ill-defined 5-7 for your paper, which is the whole point of doing note cards in the first place... illuminate the stuff that doesn't work\ stichure: You should be able to find 5-7 for your paper redhedhuff: i make chocolate boxes! stichure: What's your story, zoo stichure: I mean the one you're working on zoochikk: After we spoke on campus i felt confident and now i am going brain dead s10all422s2000: zoochikk: same ol thing..saying alot yet not really saying what i need stichure: Because of the number of people I speak to a Raider basis, you will all have to remind me what your paper is zoochikk: yeller paper stichure: ok stichure: red? stichure: 2k? s10all422s2000: yellow stichure: gracias zoochikk: that story was weird....i could totally relate stichure: lets chat zoochikk: ok stichure: i knw we gabbed a little stichure: but i think 2k and zoo missed it zoochikk: what is a good theme for a worn path? zoochikk: hehe stichure: lets talk yeller zoochikk: may i throw something out?? zoochikk: ok stichure: yes stichure: please zoochikk: your opinion? s10all422s2000: always shop around for quotes when replacing a floor with "a worn path" stichure: yes you may throw out myopinion zoochikk: gemme second to type zoochikk: no i want your opinion and brain zoochikk: hold on one minute stichure: 2k, my floor is aown path stichure: yeesh stichure: my floor is a worn path stichure: between frig and couch s10all422s2000: HAHAHA redhedhuff: oft used bit of sod stichure: 2k , why did you pick yellow wallpaper stichure: and dont tell me it matched teh carpet s10all422s2000: because my partner is sharon (red) and for peer editing purposes s10all422s2000: LOL and it brigtened the pastels redhedhuff: i saw his truck, it has yellow flowers on it s10all422s2000: plus after reading it i was very intrigued to learn more about what was behind the craziness s10all422s2000: LOL no flowers on the truck!!!! i swear stichure: hehehe stichure: Let's do some brainstorming... stichure: You always start with the basic elements stichure: And of course, your secondary sources are going to give you ideas. But if you do not understand with secondary sources saying, it will be of no value to you s10all422s2000: tru tru stichure: 2000, have you gotten a basic idea as to what you're going to do or are you still merely gathering secondary sources s10all422s2000: ive taken notes and am trying to gather my thoughts of theme, symbols, character, pov, etc stichure: give me one zoochikk: i will talk to you later Professor zoochikk: I can't find it s10all422s2000: why i gotta be put on the spot haha s10all422s2000: ummmm well stichure: because we ove tosee you dance s10all422s2000: for theme im working on some sort of feminism oppression ideas s10all422s2000: and how the time period relates redhedhuff: how about the necessity of busting out? redhedhuff: couldn't really do it peacefully, too much opposition s10all422s2000: the "man" keepin ya down stichure: fem oppresion....gott a be careful 2000...keep it close to the irony symbol conflict thing redhedhuff: so you've met my other half? stichure: lots of feminist critique s10all422s2000: ooo i c stichure: which is ok if they focus on irony stichure: symbols stichure: conflict (likely) s10all422s2000: in* stichure: yes 2000 stichure: exactly zoochikk: what are we discussing here? stichure: and adds irony and conflict s10all422s2000: main focus = symbols, irony, conflict stichure: yellow wallpaper, zoo redhedhuff: Jane and husband, society, self, Jenie( why don't you stand up for me?) stichure: yes s10all422s2000: not theme zoochikk: oh the crazy lady zoochikk: or was the husband making her think so? stichure: btw, i noted onw of the sources zoo had wasn interview in which gilman says jane is not the narrator s10all422s2000: hhhmmm stichure: 200, theme is ok stichure: oopps stichure: youve been demoted stichure: by 10 zoochikk: see, ya diggin my notecards s10all422s2000: hehe stichure: narrator is nameless redhedhuff: i sent that one too. I didn't get that one. Said the author had no name stichure: authior of this fictiotious story=narrator redhedhuff: but he story daid JANE stichure: no stichure: We discussed this last week... read the sentence... the narrator speaks about Jane stichure: That was my point at that time stichure: She was talking about a person Jane as if there another person... somebody keeping her him stichure: Keeping her in s10all422s2000: yes but isn't it out of body??? it is a first person piece? stichure: If the author Gilman chose to make in their Raider nameless, what is the significance stichure: It is a first-person piece redhedhuff: then it could be any woman who wanted to take on the persona stichure: 2000, I don't understand the out of body comment stichure: There you go stichure: Symbol number one stichure: heheh stichure: The paper almost writes itself stichure: Except for the typing s10all422s2000: oh n/m i was confused stichure: The research stichure: The use of terminology stichure: Inserting quotes stichure: Etc. s10all422s2000: dang the typing stichure: For a story like this, look to your secondary sources to give you essentials... start with the conflict stichure: And you should be able to find the conflicts as well s10all422s2000: inner conflict s10all422s2000: woman vs man stichure: The more subtle ones will come later, but you should be able to find at least a man versus man, a man versus self, and a man versus nature/society stichure: Those are two separate ones 2000, right? s10all422s2000: yes stichure: examples or specifics? stichure: zoo...any conflicts you see? redhedhuff: I have a question. One of the resorces says that the story could be seen as an argument between John and narrator. That his insistance on her staying put is another way men poh pooh women's ability to think rationally stichure: yes.... redhedhuff: so that's OK? stichure: how would that work with the context of your paper? zoochikk: hahahah red stichure: irony stichure: conflcit s10all422s2000: "I get unreasonably angry w/ john sometimes I'm sure I never used to be so sensite. I think it's due to this nervous condition" stichure: symbol' redhedhuff: could be a theme, but I'm not settled on that s10all422s2000: shes constantly fighting her "nervous condition" redhedhuff: could be a point of conflict man against man(woman0 zoochikk: writing themes take forever stichure: 2000, explain their pwerpspectives so we see teh deeper nature of teh conflict stichure: ahhh...m vs self 2000 stichure: yes redhead stichure: or s10all422s2000: yes stichure: from authors pers[pective stichure: who does john represent s10all422s2000: "The Man" stichure: then hit me with some basic elemnts, zoo....irony, sy,mbol, setting etc s10all422s2000: the stereotypical male of the late 1800s and societys view of the woman role stichure: second is better answer 2000 s10all422s2000: p.s. by me saying my ideas they aren't void for use in my paper are they stichure: no stichure: i want thme there redhedhuff: he represents society with its rigid rules and lack of understanding. s10all422s2000: hehe stichure: nice redhead stichure: zoo...try one s10all422s2000: last time i had a lot of the ideas in chat and used them and got told! haha just messin stichure: heheh stichure: i want stuff not found here as well, 2k stichure: i know yer gonna surprise me s10all422s2000: i'm having trouble seeing what Jennie represents? stichure: we discusse dthis last week...any ideas, red? stichure: tis has to do with authors bigger point zoochikk: Sorry Professor i am working on paper stichure: as to who is to blame for teh subjugation of women, as far as gilman is concerned zoochikk: Didn't mean to ignore redhedhuff: what is normal? zoochikk: i am swamped redhedhuff: she blames society, but Jennie, a woman didn't help either. it's up to each individual to break loose and free self s10all422s2000: the woman is to blam? for lettin it happen? stichure: is jennie on janes side stichure: uninvolved stichure: or on johns side s10all422s2000: she blames something unseen "a condition" s10all422s2000: johns? redhedhuff: maybe she's sympathetic, but she caves in too easily to brother's values s10all422s2000: she doesnt help that's for sure stichure: well, tehn what is gilmans point redhedhuff: she wants to understand, but doesn't have the follow thhrough stichure: by having a jennie character redhedhuff: it's every woman for herself s10all422s2000: not all women are useless? s10all422s2000: hehe j/k stichure: maybe stronger than that , red, althoigh you could go with that redhedhuff: most women FELT what jane did, but they too caved to society s10all422s2000: that the ones who give in to their s10all422s2000: "role" are happier? stichure: that may be a point, 2k redhedhuff: can't fight city hall? stichure: perhpas there is also a more pointed one stichure: a call to action stichure: why redhead stichure: why cave stichure: besides city hall s10all422s2000: women need to unite in order to brak free stichure: ahhh stichure: and so who is more to blame stichure: john orjenniw stichure: sf sdbvvuvh trv s10all422s2000: the women stichure: john or jenniw stichure: why redhedhuff: if other women looked at jane, they might not want to fight the man. they might decide, like a battered woman, to just take the easy way out s10all422s2000: because the let it happen zoochikk: i feel like i missed alot so bear with me...when you said cave in to society, what are you talking about?? s10all422s2000: the give in and play along stichure: yes redhead stichure: that is half stichure: yes 2k stichure: jennie is pressured to play teh woman role so her life is in ways easier than janes who has to fight stichure: jennie is part of teh problem s10all422s2000: so using "the role" is definitely a part of whats going on in the story right? s10all422s2000: so using "the role" is definitely a part of whats going on in the story right? redhedhuff: actually, this story reminds me of a self defense tactic I heard about a long time ago. If a woman was being raped, they were to fart, poop, thro up, do whateeer it took to turn off the rapist and disgust him, stichure: in worn path, phoenix espect whites to discriminate (green bush ) but if a black person holds her back thatwould be worse redhedhuff: Jennie is NORMAl and she goes with the flow. Jane is crazy, she's fighting the nornm s10all422s2000: taking the worn path is a much easier road then cutiing your way through the scrubs (i mean shrubs stichure: yes 2k stichure: but in teh context of conflcit and irony and symbol rather than feminist crit... zoochikk: I am LOST ! s10all422s2000: aaawww ok, but can we use a little crit? stichure: yes, red......nothing more frightening (thratening) THAN one willing to be abnormal stichure: example 2k zoochikk: I have no clue what were talking about s10all422s2000: well it just seems that the author definitely intended to fight the role a woman is supposed to play, and a little feminist crit would help clarify that s10all422s2000: yello wall paper zoo stichure: zoo...follow me here...wat is jane fighting against? stichure: yes 2k, but we are looking for basic literary elements...ie do you knwo what a symbol is etc zoochikk: jane (the wife) is fighting against being a cooped up woman redhedhuff: she's fight ing the walls and bars that keep her from being who she is redhedhuff: she stichure: dont get bogged down in deeper critical perpsectives stichure: yes, zoo...who is she fighting zoochikk: her hubbie zoochikk: hubby zoochikk: i know he is a MD, is he keeping her drugged up on purpose? stichure: man vs.... zoochikk: man stichure: there ya go stichure: and he represents.. zoochikk: kaka stichure: who put those up, red? zoochikk: haha zoochikk: he represents the thing keeping her down zoochikk: ? zoochikk: tomorrow stichure: thanks stichure: zooo zoochikk: he is a ball and chain to Jennie stichure: who also agrees with john in teh idea that women shouldnt write redhedhuff: Dr. Weir stichure: jennie is johns sister..johns wife teh narrator is either innamed or clalled jane by soem critics zoochikk: women SHOULD write, we have LOTS to say stichure: zoo zoochikk: thank you for clearing it up zoochikk: yes? stichure: stay focused on this point stichure: did they agree in 1890's? stichure: that women should write? zoochikk: no stichure: so who does john represnt stichure: red, why use a dr in this story...symbolically zoochikk: the people who say women do not write redhedhuff: authority figure, always right , the learned old doc stichure: which was whom in 1890's zoo zoochikk: i don't know what to call them?? zoochikk: the men?? stichure: yes red...so while he is literal he is also figurative,symbolic zoochikk: oh like red said earlier 'the man' stichure: zoo...do the majority agree with jane or john zoochikk: john stichure: so john represnts .... s10all422s2000: brb redhedhuff: society zoochikk: the winning side?? stichure: thanks red stichure: society is usually teh winning side zoochikk: zoochikk: can i ask a question about that room redhedhuff: so Jane must fight secretly, at night, to free the woman in the wallapaer stichure: yes zoo stichure: symbol, red? stichure: night zoochikk: what does the woman in the paper represent? jane? zoochikk: and why does the room smell? stichure: how does she represent jane, zoo redhedhuff: darkness = against society. all that is acceptable happens in light. all that is sinister, at night zoochikk: being confined and trapped stichure: red...dont follow teh first part stichure: nice zoo zoochikk: ty stichure: and wat is teh smell>' zoochikk: ?? zoochikk: stank zoochikk: stinky wallpaper i meant to say zoochikk: old?] stichure: what is the sentence? zoochikk: i am not sure why the room had an odor stichure: and why would narrator say it that way stichure: it depends on teh odor stichure: and how it was said zoochikk: lookin.... s10all422s2000: page 7 zoochikk: she said it was in her hair (the smell) and hanging on her s10all422s2000: its the most enduring odor zoochikk: the smell is not beautiful but old foul bad yellow things zoochikk: and the wallpaper always has new shoots of fungus s10all422s2000: it used to disturb me at first. I thought seriously of burning the hose - to reach the smell. zoochikk: sounds like a haunted house s10all422s2000: a yellow smeel s10all422s2000: smell zoochikk: such a peculiar odor, too! i have spent hours trying to analyze it to find what it smelled like stichure: well....what does a yellwo smell smell like? zoochikk: the only thing i can think of is it is like the color of the paper a yellow smell stichure: in her hair zoochikk: urine stichure: apply to teh story zoochikk: or mold stichure: apply to te story zoochikk: they said it has been damp stichure: her situation redhedhuff: life stinks zoochikk: the weather has been damp zoochikk: oh zoochikk: why yellow though stichure: hehe stichure: indeed red stichure: yelow is symbolic s10all422s2000: a yellow smell is a trapped smell -- she wants to burn the house to reach the smell stichure: ofwhat redhedhuff: you said cowardly ;ast week, so the smell of cowardice zoochikk: the sun she does not see anymore stichure: apply that symbols 2000...whta is hse considering to chjatge things stichure: what stichure: she stichure: change s10all422s2000: breakin free stichure: yellow means cowardice stichure: among other things yes s10all422s2000: burnin down the house, thats a song right stichure: but smell...that adds a dimension s10all422s2000: yellow smell all i think of is dasys zoochikk: i think of lemons when i smell yellow redhedhuff: house has a life of its own, its real s10all422s2000: sour stichure: i dont think she was making a talking heads ref 100 years before david b wrote teh song zoochikk: so it is haunted? stichure: sour stichure: what is sour for her s10all422s2000: hahaha s10all422s2000: life stichure: haunted bywhat , zooo stichure: yes 2000 s10all422s2000: her trapped situation redhedhuff: fear? zoochikk: red said the house has a life of its own stichure: nice redhead stichure: the house represnt anything, zoo stichure: a house that traps jane stichure: that smells of dankness zoochikk: i thought it was like the Haunting....a prison s10all422s2000: house is the society that empowers john stichure: that she considers destroying redhedhuff: prison stichure: isnt she in prison? zoochikk: it represents a prison zoochikk: yes she is stichure: nice 2k s10all422s2000: no one else use that hehe stichure: i think red mentioned bars already stichure: hehehof course not 2k stichure: (furiously writing down 2ks idea) s10all422s2000: LOL stichure: where are the bars s10all422s2000: on the windows zoochikk: so i take it the husband knows exactly what he is doing...letting her think she is going crazy and keeping her out of it on pain meds? s10all422s2000: i think its more metaphorically zoochikk: she is fine.,huh? redhedhuff: they are actually on the wallpaper, so does that mean they are part of life. They are everywhere s10all422s2000: ya she might have went crasy though trying to fight the good fight s10all422s2000: oh ya, their in the paper zoochikk: and she is on pain meds, correct? stichure: for a woman, even now, is the place indicated by society just in one or two places...or evrywhere s10all422s2000: everywhere stichure: what kind of pain meds metaphoriclly are offered to keep women sedated stichure: in thei rplace zoochikk: valume redhedhuff: if they were in the plaid of the wallpqper, that's what women wore plaid, so even in what they chose s10all422s2000: pots and pans zoochikk: sleeping pills? s10all422s2000: hehe just palyin zoochikk: need a "new drug" stichure: symbolic, zoo stichure: hehee s10all422s2000: we're gonna get beat up proffessor stichure: 2k stichure: yer funny s10all422s2000: roofies zoochikk: one that wont spill, one that wont cost too much... redhedhuff: pinkums little pills stichure: what "drugs" keep people in their place zoochikk: mothers little helper redhedhuff: nerve pills zoochikk: pot stichure: in this case women stichure: not real drugs stichure: metaphor...symbol stichure: things that act as drugs ot placate stichure: sedate s10all422s2000: "come now little girl" youll catch cols zoochikk: contenment'\ stichure: pacify redhedhuff: placating them and making them feel stichure: yes 2k zoochikk: being content s10all422s2000: shoes! stichure: example, zoo s10all422s2000: haha stichure: yes 2k stichure: contentmet is result zoochikk: being satisfied redhedhuff: maids, cool clothes, sewing circles, stichure: what are you offwered to stop pushing ofr equlaity stichure: yes red s10all422s2000: telling them there's nothing wrong "its all in their head" stichure: yes stichure: 2k zoochikk: with what you got. or where you live if your cool your gonna stay redhedhuff: big house, vacations in Europe and freedom to roam, not locked up stichure: zoo, if yer gonna use this one, you need to usea specific... stichure: yes red s10all422s2000: what about symbolically in the story? stichure: look at jennie stichure: what is her reward, so to speak....for compliance stichure: GOOD QUESTION, 2k zoochikk: well if ya got all that you need to have money stichure: what is she offered s10all422s2000: she gets to visit redhedhuff: a place to stay and John's care taking. stichure: red, what is she offered if she comlies stichure: complies redhedhuff: She moves quietly, so she's not too noticeable zoochikk: she gets free room and board?? redhedhuff: she gets John's favor stichure: it would be something he is offering her stichure: yes, redhead s10all422s2000: she gets to go back "home" stichure: pleasing another stichure: being told stichure: yer ok now stichure: yes 2k redhedhuff: good girl zoochikk: ummm redhedhuff: heaven only knows, we all want to be good girls zoochikk: haha my mind was in the gutter for a second zoochikk: not me red s10all422s2000: LOL but you the bad boys! stichure: this one is interesting but you will have to look for teh "drug" shoe would be offered...i think jennie is a clue..what she has that jane doesnt zoochikk: s10all422s2000: she has some freedom zoochikk: elbow room stichure: yee stichure: yes redhedhuff: she is able to aquiese (sp?) and play the gamee stichure: yes zoo s10all422s2000: she has some "say" in waht happens stichure: yes red stichure: yes 2k s10all422s2000: only a tiny bit though redhedhuff: if you just play nice, you can have it all s10all422s2000: just enough to keep her complient stichure: and whatthreat is jane to jennie stichure: why would jennie see jane as a threat stichure: and therefore not even want to sidewith her redhedhuff: she's rocking the boat, making John angry stichure: yes stichure: bigger, red stichure: which boat stichure: who angry s10all422s2000: if jane gets better jennies "vacation house" is gone haha redhedhuff: the whole balance of power for the sexes s10all422s2000: if she has the courage to stand up for herself then everything will be "worse" redhedhuff: she's afraid Jane will blow it for the rest of the gals s10all422s2000: at least thats what jennie thinks stichure: heheh..2k ..yer evil...funny, but evil stichure: yes red s10all422s2000: redhedhuff: a bit like Little women. stichure: jo rocking the boat? redhedhuff: yep, always the creative one stichure: code for lesbian? redhedhuff: women like that got lots of stern looks from others redhedhuff: I don't know, I never dated her! stichure: or just "different?" stichure: hehehe redhedhuff: No, I don't tink so, but I bet men did! redhedhuff: That's always a way to hush a woman. to qustion her gender identity stichure: well, the idea that a woman could have mind of her own was disregarded as anomaly..as abberation stichure: yes redhedhuff: Now, if she locked the door to stay IN the room with the woman in the wallpaper! stichure: same for men who are sensitive stichure: hehe s10all422s2000: dang what i miss??? haha stichure: that would be different redhedhuff: yep zoochikk: haha stichure: well,she is freeing teh woman behind teh paper stichure: and tehy both escape stichure: wow redhedhuff: we'd know though, her name would have been Gertie stichure: a new subtext stichure: but queer theory is next semster redhedhuff: yes, she's fighting for them all s10all422s2000: i read one or two secondary sources about that redhedhuff: for this story? s10all422s2000: in those "other" chat rooms HAHAHAHA stichure: i bet , 2k ,,,,, stichure: it certainly works, butagain, try not to go that dep stichure: i do cover this story in 103 and we get into these issues s10all422s2000: save that for 103 redhedhuff: she sees herself in that wallpaper, so she's freeing jane stichure: yes, redhead...iroiny? stichure: we really ahvent discussed any ironies redhedhuff: yes, she's really putting jane away for good s10all422s2000: how is that an ironic? stichure: we have symbol, conflict, setting... stichure: yeah red...how is that ironic> redhedhuff: she frees herself temporarily, but in the proces, she becomes a casualty of war and goes bonkers stichure: so to free oneself fromoppression, a woman must.... redhedhuff: also separate from society redhedhuff: and separate from rea;ity s10all422s2000: walk the fine line and do some of the "role" things, and some of her own things stichure: red, second is better stichure: 2k, do we see that in tjis story> stichure: do we seeanyone walking the line>? stichure: remember, you cantadd soemthing that aint there s10all422s2000: jennie stichure: if gilman only shows two extrmes, that swhat youhaveto work with s10all422s2000: she has some freedoms stichure: how is she acting emancipated zoochikk has left the conference. stichure: within the limited nature of a woman...is she allowed into a mans realm...writing for example>? s10all422s2000: op that's tru i guess redhedhuff: didn't women write fluffy novels then? redhedhuff: was that OK? stichure: if anything at all, yes stichure: and were they taken seriously> redhedhuff: were they outsiders? stichure: and what happned when they stepped out of those limtations?> redhedhuff: they were hammered s10all422s2000: big nono stichure: what is gilman saying about the choices for women> redhedhuff: LIMITED s10all422s2000: must stay within their role stichure: is there a compromise or is it do as we say or you are screwed stichure: or, 2k... s10all422s2000: do as we say not as we do redhedhuff: I think women, as smart as we are, probably did a lot of sneakylivin on the side redhedhuff: but also they were screwed redhedhuff: who wrote madame Bovary? stichure: well, it was common for women to get published under male psudonyms stichure: georg sand stichure: geroge eliot redhedhuff: Thanks redhedhuff: I think the strongest woman in all of literature is... Pipi Longstockings stichure: gustav flaubert i think was male stichure: yes, i dont think any poteh rowman could pick up a horse s10all422s2000: huh? stichure: any other woman s10all422s2000: i must be seeing the gen gap here hehe stichure: hehehe stichure: funny stichure: its old redhedhuff: POOOO on you! stichure: butit is made into mopvies and tv all the time s10all422s2000: LOL just messin stichure: 2k...making friends wherever he goes redhedhuff: Don't worry, i got my wheelchair all oiled for our peer editing! s10all422s2000: <---- worldwide s10all422s2000: haha stichure: hehehe redhedhuff: what does the window mean again? s10all422s2000: a possibility to see the "outside world" where the men dwell? stichure: welll,,what does a window represnt genrally stichure: nice 2k stichure: beat me to it s10all422s2000: is that a good one? s10all422s2000: i'm using it then!!!! haha redhedhuff: glass wall separates? stichure: it sthe best EVER s10all422s2000: LOL stichure: nice red...glass ceiling wasnt even invented then but it certailny applies s10all422s2000: tru stichure: yopu can seewhere you may not go s10all422s2000: yep, exactly redhedhuff: so it was frustrating to see but not be able to partake s10all422s2000: unless you "break through" the glass stichure: yes redhedhuff: wallpaper first, then glass stichure: danger in breaking the glass, 2k? s10all422s2000: which is much easier then breaking down a wall or peeling an entire room wallpaper down haha s10all422s2000: you could get cut stichure: wallpaper...what is she peeling away/ stichure: yes s10all422s2000: you might not succeed, but youll die trying stichure: and once teh glass is broken? s10all422s2000: no your causing a scene and everything is kaos redhedhuff: some will get hurt, then it will be cleaned up and things get better redhedhuff: calls attention to the problem stichure: well, think about permanence stichure: and what a window does stichure: and what happens if its broken s10all422s2000: aaaawwwww i c the light redhedhuff: replaced easily stichure: and why the others want it unbroken stichure: soem images simlar in everyday use wioth winmdowless hoiuse stichure: windowless hoiuse stichure: how resdhead stichure: she breaks thru and.... redhedhuff: keep certain things in and certain things out stichure: and danger of breaking glass>' s10all422s2000: then the wrong things can get in and out redhedhuff: roles too grayed s10all422s2000: stichure: once you break the glass...from society's persective redhedhuff: you pay s10all422s2000: your the "rebel" s10all422s2000: you screwed up stichure: hmmmm redhedhuff: no? stichure: bigger s10all422s2000: no one wants to go down with you stichure: more symbolic stichure: if house is socirty redhedhuff: martyr? stichure: what happens if glass is broken s10all422s2000: you get punishde stichure: if glass is barrier between men and women, what id risk of brealing glass? redhedhuff: being ousted s10all422s2000: no more dinner! stichure: hehhe s10all422s2000: ummm role reversal? stichure: You're looking at this from her view... s10all422s2000: shift of power stichure: But remember, she wouldn't mind breaking the window stichure: Look at it from society's view... why would John and those he represents not want her to break the window stichure: Look at the metaphor there s10all422s2000: other women would be scared they cant be taken care of? redhedhuff: from his view? she must be nuts s10all422s2000: they dont want to lose control! redhedhuff: challenge to authority redhedhuff: come on tell us! s10all422s2000: everything was the mans way or the highway and they would lose that stichure: And why would the author used glass as the metaphor... what is the nature of glass or a window and the effect that she is trying to get across redhedhuff: shatters society? s10all422s2000: that control is fagile stichure: Very good 2000 stichure: Very good redhead s10all422s2000: can i phone a friend or use the 50/50 lifeline? hehe stichure: That is on the right course stichure: The author is using such a fragile, and at that time expensive, symbol because it has to do with the fragility of situation and the veritable risk stichure: Associated with breaking glass... stichure: At that time, how fixable would it be and how does that reflects societies perception of the threat of a woman writer s10all422s2000: expensive, and not easily fixed redhedhuff: that she would upset that balance of power and it wasn't worth it s10all422s2000: the proffessionl male's role was much more important than the females and they did not want women writers to level the playing field redhedhuff: Jane shredded that waapaper, but the glass could shred her in return stichure: And once that window was broken,... once that breach has been made, how easy would it be to undo the situation stichure: Once that window is open, besides Jane passing through, what might else be allowed to pass through stichure: I think you're on the right track redhedhuff: for Jane not easy, she would be free, but for John, he could replace her s10all422s2000: the rest of the women, jennie, bugs stichure: Make sure you get me your note cards as soon as possible, 2000 stichure: heheh stichure: bugs stichure: You have about a month stichure: Or less s10all422s2000: ok ill do my very best redhedhuff: You said I didn't have to send another copy, but do i add it to my final draft of essay? stichure: No redhead redhedhuff: of the note cards stichure: The notecards are specifically designed for me to see what your research is like. Once or papers written, it doesn't matter s10all422s2000: no just works cited to the final copy, right? stichure: Once your paper is written, it doesn't matter redhedhuff: cool stichure: Exactly s10all422s2000: aight then s10all422s2000: good night folks redhedhuff: Ok MIke call me redhedhuff: Good Night see you next week stichure: Take care, 2000 stichure: Have a good week, redhead s10all422s2000: ill be in texas next week, but ill see you the week after stichure: ASAP, redhead redhedhuff: done redhedhuff: ok stichure: Enjoy, 2000 redhedhuff has left the conference. s10all422s2000 has left the conference.