Joined on May 9, 2012 at 6:22 PM Moderator: 101 Moderator: hey now Chris: hey hey Moderator: how s the final paper coming along Moderator: hey ball Chris: slowly... nicmball 1: hello Moderator: which are you doing for the final paper nicmball 1: story of an hour Chris: same Moderator: a popular choice, especially when people see that it's only a page and a half nicmball 1: and im kinda confused. the note cards are in mla format with a short description of what the source is saying? nicmball 1: hahaha Moderator: that is correct, ball nicmball 1: ok and how do we do that for the articles and biographies on the gale lit site? Moderator: Did you read last week's chat? nicmball 1: yea i was actually there, but i guess i forgot or didn't notice it haha Moderator: Well, what I was pointing out Moderator: and you can look at this now if you get onto Gail Moderator: at the bottom of each article Moderator: is the source Moderator: it is called “source citation” Moderator: it is at the bottom of the article Moderator: you just copy and paste that nicmball 1: ok so we use that citation then Moderator: yes Moderator: what you don't want to do is include the URL that underneath it nicmball 1: oh ok. Moderator: Bethea, Arthur F. "Carver's 'Wes Hardin: From a Photograph' and 'A Small, Good Thing.'." Explicator 57.3 (Spring 1999): 176-179. Rpt. in Short Story Criticism. Vol. 104. Detroit: Gale, 2007. Literature Resource Center. Web. 2 May 2012. Moderator: author Moderator: title of the article Moderator: the publication it was printed in, including publication information for anything that journal, such as volume. Moderator: City Moderator: year Moderator: you'll notice that they also add the fact you found it in the LRC Moderator: and your access date Moderator: underneath that, you would give me an explanation as to what it is for your note cards/annotated works Moderator: biography Moderator: symbolic analysis Moderator: thematic analysis Moderator: anything like that Moderator: did either of you take the makeup test nicmball 1: got it. nicmball 1: No i didn't Chris: no i did not either Moderator: did either of you read Cathedral nicmball 1: no Moderator: well, since you're here, let's talk about story of an hour nicmball 1: ok Moderator: what's the basic plot Chris: feeling free about the eath of her husband Moderator: hello Barbara. nicmball 1: death of husband Moderator: Actually, a neither is really the plot. Moderator: When asked about the plot, I want to tell me who did what. Moderator: Barbara, what story did you choose for your final paper Barbara: The Yellow Wallpaper Moderator: have you started your research Barbara Barbara: Yes I have but I feel like I don't know what I am looking for Moderator: Chris, Ball, have you read the story of an hour? Moderator: Barbara, keep in mind that I'm asking you specifically for symbolism, irony and conflict Moderator: as we did last week, you would open a search engine that essentially has the author's name, the title of the work, and one of those words Moderator: and you would get a great number of responses in terms of articles written about your story Moderator: you need to read those articles Moderator: you're looking for stuff that can help you to analyze your story choice Moderator: because you got a use these resources, directly quoted, along with the primary source, the story, to explain symbols and ironies and conflicts Moderator: Chris, ball, did you read the story of an hour? Barbara: I read the story of an hour nicmball 1: Mrs mallard was told that her husband was killed in a railroad accident and after that she died herself. Moderator: If you didn't, you can either read it right now… it's a page and a half… or we can talk about it another time Moderator: excellent barbara. Moderator: Sort of ball… course the most important part is that middle section which is the actual story Moderator: what does she do between being told her husband was killed and herself dying nicmball 1: she kept saying free free free body and soul free Moderator: she did…where was she nicmball 1: in a room by herself Moderator: what was she doing in there nicmball 1: crying Moderator: Barbara you can join in the conversation if you like since you have read it Moderator: why she crying nicmball 1: because her husband died is what i got from it nicmball 1: but it's hard because she seems like she is happy he's dead even though she loved him Barbara: because she was finally free from the marriage and her husband who made her a kept woman Moderator: you're going to try to write an 8 to 12 page paper based on a page and a half story… you're going to have to understand the subtlety of it Moderator: show me that she loved him ball Moderator: find a passage in the story where it says that Moderator: Barbara, show me where she feels her husband made her a kept woman Moderator: no matter what you claim, it's important to be able to show me where that happened in the story Moderator: Hey, William nicmball 1: "And yet she had loved him--sometimes. Often she had not" (Chopin 122) Moderator: at the red story of an hour? William: Hey Moderator: Ball, I'm getting a mixed message there Chris: yea i am not so sure about a 8-12 pg paper on a page and a half Barbara: first of all she was sick with a heart condition Moderator: have you read story of an hour William nicmball 1: she did love him at some point. Moderator: um Barbara… you want to translate that Moderator: well it says it sometimes ball… are there other any Moderator: phrases from the story which tells us how she felt about the marriage overall Moderator: will Chris, understand that I know it can be done. It's done every semester and of course the ability to do that is the ability to find multiple symbols and ironies and conflicts in a very condensed work Moderator: your secondary sources are going to point out a lot of these Moderator: but our conversation here today here help you to understand how to look for them Chris: there seems to be alot of symbols in the story.. it is very discriptive but i am still unsure Moderator: Barbara, explained what that means Moderator: well Chris, let's have a conversation Moderator: explain Mrs. Mallard's malady nicmball 1: heart condition Chris: she had heart trouble Moderator: what does that mean Barbara: the part where she is now able to live for herself and no pwerfull will bending hers p. 122 Moderator: Barbara are you explaining the heart trouble or are you explaining that Mrs. Mallard was unhappy in her marriage Barbara: the husband seemed to be overbearing on her Chris: she doesnt seem to be able to live a full life Barbara: the heart trouble may have been a result of her unhappy marriage. Stress Moderator: now let's answer the question about her malady Moderator: Barbara, remember that I want conflict irony and symbolism Moderator: start with the obvious and the easiest… conflict Moderator: label and explain Chris: man v self joy and grief Moderator to William: Did you read story of an hour? Moderator to William: if not, it's only one page and a half... Moderator: joy for what and grief for what Chris Moderator: try to give me a full answer when you do Moderator: if she has joy that she won $1 million but she's sad her grandmother died, that is not necessarily internal conflict Barbara: there was some conflict where she loved her husband - Sometimes! Chris: she first feels the grief of her husband dying but hten begins to feel free and a overwhelming joy Barbara: often she did not love him Moderator: Barbara, again, label the conflict and tell me what two sides of the conflict are Moderator: that is a better answer Chris Moderator: she is both grief stricken and joyful that her husband died. Moderator: It's about the same events with two conflicting responses Moderator: why is she happy that he died William: Not sufering? William: I have no idea,. Barbara: she had a love-hate relationship with her husband. She was sad he died but happy to be free of the relationship with him. Moderator: very good Barbara Moderator: what was her physical malady again Chris: her husband? Moderator: William, the story is rather condensed, that's for sure, but the author does make it clear what the characters feeling. Since really the only character we see is Mrs. Mallard, it's Moderator: quite focused on her issues Moderator: Chris I'm not Following.... explain? Chris: it almost seems the the heart condition comes and goes with his presence unless im way off in my interpretation haha Moderator: You're not way off. But you're missing an opportunity Moderator: folks… according to the narrative, what is wrong with her heart Chris: its non specific right? nicmball 1: heart disease Moderator: actually, the doctor and the narrative both explain her problem with her heart Moderator: is that what it says Ball? Barbara: her heart is troubled Moderator: is that what it says Barbara? nicmball 1: it says thats what she died from Moderator: do we know she has a heart condition at the beginning of the story nicmball 1: no Barbara: yes Chris: yes it is the first line Moderator: Barbara… Moderator: it's interesting that you word it the way you did Moderator: how to Chopin word Barbara: it states she is afflicted with a heart troubles Moderator: with a heart trouble Moderator: notice "a heart trouble" Moderator: not heart trouble Brittany: sorry im so late Moderator: a heart trouble Moderator: it's okay Britney. Story of an hour Brittany: ok Moderator: if you haven't read it, it's only a page and a half Brittany: will start now! Moderator: the author is inviting us to take it literally Moderator: and also to take it figuratively Moderator: symbolism Moderator: what does heart refer to besides the coronary muscle Chris: the emotional center of a person Moderator: it's interesting Barbara that the way you worded it is actually accurate\ Moderator: Barbara: her heart is troubled Moderator: very good Chris Moderator: what is her heart trouble Moderator: besides coronary occlusion Chris: her husband Moderator: very good Moderator: is she happy or unhappy in her marriage Chris: symbol! Moderator: yes Moderator: but also Moderator: not just symbol Chris: a conflcit? Barbara: her heart is troubled meaning she is unhappy in her relationship with her husband. nicmball 1: irony Moderator: yes Chris Moderator: which one ball Moderator: yes Barbara nicmball 1: nevermind i read something else Moderator: uahaahha Moderator: unfortunately, Moderator: you're correct Moderator: that the end of the story, what is the doctors declaration Moderator: cause of death nicmball 1: why unfortunately??? Chris: joy Moderator: because you're bailing on your answer Moderator: and your answer was correct Chris: ahhh hahaha.. Moderator: Chris, I need to complete answer nicmball 1: haha my bad. i stick with it Moderator: is not joy Moderator: ball, unfortunately now you'll have to label it Moderator: ahhahah Chris: she died of heart disease Moderator: it's a never ending cycle of unfortunately... Moderator: Chris… joy Moderator: what kind of joy according to the doctor Moderator: you brought it up, so finished the idea Chris: the kind that kills Moderator: okay Moderator: according to the doctor, what does he think killed her Moderator: be specific nicmball 1: shes joyful that she is on her own now, but a little piece of her heart is broken because he's dead Moderator: no Barbara: they think it was heart disease Moderator: yes Moderator: but why would heart disease killer at that moment Moderator: ball, what you're giving me is her internal conflict Barbara: stress of his death Moderator: no Barbara Chris: because her husband returned from the dead Moderator: what happened just before she kills over Moderator: yes Chris Moderator: and what does the doctor think kills her Barbara: he showed up at home Chris: the joy of having him back Moderator: " a joy that kills" Moderator: yes Chris Moderator: the shock of him coming back Moderator: she is so happy Moderator: so overjoyed Moderator: so overcome with ecstasy Moderator: it kills her Moderator: what do we know Moderator: what did kill her Chris: its the tremendous dissapointment of his life Barbara: the sight of him cming through the door Moderator: hahahaha Moderator: Barbara you have to be clearer Moderator: otherwise, you're explaining what the doctor thinks Moderator: Chris the tremendous disappointment of his… Barbara: for being such a short story, it is hard to decipher. Moderator: the way you worded that it sounds like she's disappointed in his life… the way he lived his life… Chris: living-ness Moderator: Barbara, that's why it requires symbol and irony and conflict analysis Moderator: jhahaah Moderator: that is exactly it Chris Moderator: so Moderator: Dr. Moderator: Dr. says “a joy that kills” and he is implying that she died from being overjoyed at his survival Moderator: we know Moderator: she dies because she is crushed miraculous survival Moderator: label this Moderator: specific literary term Chris: irony Moderator: difference between what the character says and thinks and what we know to be different Moderator: which one Chris Brittany: dramatic irony Moderator: very good Britney Moderator: does everybody understand how this works nicmball 1: yep Moderator: finally, what is the specific conflict Barbara: yes Moderator: that killed her Moderator: there are several correct answers… please label and explain your answer in one entry Brittany: lost connection, sorry! Moderator: so I'll ask the question again Moderator: what is the conflict that is associated with her death nicmball 1: man v self happy he's back, but upset he's back at the same time Moderator: there are a couple correct answers Brittany: i agree with nic Moderator: ball, I don't think she's happy he's back Moderator: there is no evidence in the story that she's happy he's back Barbara: I dont thing she is happy either to see him after all she thought she was free! Moderator: Barbara then tell me what conflict is evident Brittany: man vs man between josephine and the husband. she doesnt want him and is happy at the thought of being rid of him, but he comes home thinking everything should be fine not knowing her true feelings Moderator: very good Britney William: The conflict is labled dramatic irony. Man vs nature. Did she even know the husband was alive? Moderator: that would explain her disappointment Moderator: the irony is labeled dramatic William Moderator: the conflict is man versus nature only if you can tell me what element of nature she is the conflict with Chris: internal conflict man v. self "But she saw beyond that bitter moment a long procession of years to come that would belong to her absolutely. And she opened and spread her arms out to them in welcome." so she is happy he is gone but also "She wept at once, with sudden, wild abandonment, in her sister's arms. When the storm of grief had spent itself she went away to her room alone. She would have no one follow her." she is sad Chris: ? Barbara: the conflict of her having a love/hate relationship with her husband because he thought he could impose his will upon her. Moderator: Chris, that is when she finds out he is dead Moderator: and that is correct Moderator: we did talk about that earlier on. I'm looking for the conflict that actually kills her at the end of the story Moderator: Barbara label that Chris: yes Chris: sorry thought that was a ? Moderator: Chris, what I wanted you to now tell me what conflict kills her at the end of the story nicmball 1: man v man she is happy he is gone, but he comes home thinking everything is all good Moderator: you're telling me the conflict she has for most of the middle of the story when she's in her room Moderator: yes ball… she is unhappy he comes home… man versus man Chris: man v. self Moderator: at the beginning and through most of the stories she has a man versus self conflict in which she is slightly said that he died but is mostly happy that she's now free Moderator: what I'm looking for is at the end of the story Moderator: another conflict that is so obvious Moderator: because it's what the doctor declares Chris: her v. heart? Moderator: it's what the doctor actually thinks Moderator: very good Chris Moderator: hahhaha Moderator: man versus what nicmball 1: nature Moderator: yes Moderator: whew William: Man vs nature Moderator: man versus man… she doesn't want her husband back but he comes back Moderator: man versus nature… her heart gives out on her Moderator: earlier on, man versus self… both happy and grief stricken about the death of her husband Moderator: so that means the death involves Moderator: a man versus man or nature conflict, along with a dramatic irony when the doctor declares the death Moderator: is there also a symbol in there Moderator: what did she say she was going to do when she realized her husband was dead Moderator: and gone Moderator: I'm looking for a specific word because it is this kind of wordplay where we get symbol and irony together Chris: live Moderator: very good Chris Moderator: therefore Moderator: either actually or metaphorically, what would the return of her husband mean for her Chris: deat Chris: h Brittany: death Moderator: exactly Moderator: even if she didn't have a heart attack, Moderator: an element of her would've died Moderator: so how long was her life Chris: a couple of hours tops nicmball 1: an hour Brittany: agreed Moderator: Chris… title Moderator: very good ball Brittany: an hour nicmball 1: hahahahahahaha Moderator: the title really could be called Brittany: life in an hour Moderator: or Chris: an hour to live Brittany: shortlived live Moderator: if her life equals hour.... Brittany: life Moderator: story out… Moderator: the story of nicmball 1: life Moderator: what's important here and what will help you in your paper is of course the ability to find this kind of density in a single element Moderator: exactly l ball Moderator: notice in this case we took the moment of her death and we found conflict irony in symbolism in multiple ways Moderator: that's how you turn one and a half pages of story into eight pages of analysis Moderator: what's her name nicmball 1: mallard Brittany: josephine Moderator: in fact, I want to look at the names for all the female characters Moderator: what is Josephine Moderator: what is Mallard Chris: duck? Barbara: a duck Moderator: what kind of duck Barbara: a male duck Moderator: explain your answer Barbara nicmball 1: most common duck in the northern hemisphere Moderator: (what is it look like) Brittany: josephine- empress nicmball 1: green head white neck Chris: green brown white stripe nicmball 1: white collar* Moderator: Mallard is a breed. Like any breed, there are both males and females. Barbara: homecoming duck Moderator: You are correct that the Mallard is what most people envision when they think of it back if it's not white Moderator: hahahah Moderator: what does the female look like Barbara: brown and white only nicmball 1: brown Barbara: not colorful like the male Barbara: no white collar like the husband the working man Moderator: http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_cQ-tyBzqpMg/S-mdc4W9qII/AAAAAAAAABQ/It0ZRlg3nR8/s1600/mallard_duck-male-female-1.jpg Moderator: which one is more important Moderator: which one is more obvious Barbara: the male nicmball 1: the male Moderator: make the connection Moderator: what year was the story written Brittany: 1894 Chris: 1894 Barbara: he is more important that she is. superior to her the female nicmball 1: 1894 Moderator: how does that relate to the era in which it was written Brittany: and he is impressing his will on her, like the last name she has "represents" him Moderator: very good Britney Moderator: also, you might want to look at the mating habits of ducks Barbara: women's oppression Moderator: the specific Barbara nicmball 1: men worked women stayed at home to cook clean and take care of kids Moderator: Be specific Barbara Moderator: well, is Mrs. Mallard the type of person is going to be cleaning a house Moderator: is she in that social class Moderator: / Moderator: for both story of an hour and yellow wallpaper, it is important you understand the social position of women at that time in history and were talking about both socially and legally Moderator: is Mrs. Mallard And her husband working class or upper class? William: Working class Brittany: ducks have aggressive sexual behavior Barbara: no she is high society Moderator: William, show me Moderator: very good Britney Moderator: show me that in the story Moderator: show me that Barbara William: Railroad workers are workering class. Moderator: is not a railroad worker William Moderator: read carefully Moderator: look what he is wearing when he comes home Moderator: he is a commuter Barbara: travel-stained Moderator: working clothes or suit nicmball 1: suit Barbara: suit Brittany: it said composedly, so id guess suit? Chris: doesnr say Chris: maybe suit because of the umbrella .. were those only for the higher class? Moderator: what is a grip sack Moderator: very good Chris Brittany: a briefcase Moderator: Yass Moderator: what does he do for a living Moderator: work with his hands or work in an office Barbara: so he is a businessman nicmball 1: business man Moderator: yes Brittany: in an office Moderator: small house or a big house Brittany: big nicmball 1: big Brittany: stairs Barbara: big house Moderator: is she likely to do housework herself Brittany: no Barbara: no she probably has a housekeeper Chris: no Moderator: however, is she oppressed by her husband Barbara: yes Moderator: show me a passage from the story Moderator: Britney, you told us that ducks have aggressive sexual behavior… show me that in the story Barbara: there would be no powerful will bending hers in that blind pesisitence wit hwhich men and women believe the yahve a right to impose a provate will upon a fellow-creature. Moderator: very good Moderator: I want to look at the name Josephine… you are correct that it is a famous Empress… who was Josephine's mate Barbara: sorry for the misspelling prof. Moderator: hahahah Brittany: as powerless as her two white slender hands would have been Moderator: I am in no position to talk about misspellings and typos in this chat Moderator: very good Britney Chris: Now her bosom rose and fell tumultuously. She was beginning to recognize this thing that was approaching to possess her, and she was striving to beat it back with her will--as powerless as her two white slender hands would have been. When she abandoned herself a little whispered word escaped her slightly parted lips. She said it over and over under hte breath: "free, free, free!" Moderator: a points that she is definitely weaker and less powerful Moderator: Chris, and that tells us what Brittany: that she is free of his will Moderator: yes Barbara: the will he has imposed upon her Moderator: yes Moderator: look at the name Josephine… who is Josephine's mate? nicmball 1: napoleon Moderator: What kind of person was Napoleon nicmball 1: power hungry Moderator: how did he treat other people Chris: conquer Moderator: yes Chris: as his subjects Moderator: is this consistent with the position of our character Moderator: are we getting a repetition of the same idea over and over again? Brittany: yes Brittany: oppressed woman by overbearing man Moderator: what is the name of the other woman in the story William: Lousie? Moderator: Louise Moderator: what does the name Louise and the name Josephine have in common Brittany: wasnt josephine the sister and louise is mrs mallard? William: ^^ Moderator: you are correct Britney Moderator: does it change the meaning of Josephine Moderator: is Josephine any freer Moderator: than Louise Moderator: hahahaha Moderator: is there a consistency of the position of the female characters in the story William: Consistency in what sense? Moderator: is Mrs. Mallard (Louise) oppressed Brittany: i cant find the definiteion of louise William: Sounds typical? Brittany: yea Moderator: is Josephine also oppressed? Brittany: yes Moderator: How do you know that Moderator: has anybody found any information about what's going on in 1894 for women William: Women were mens property. William: 1894* Moderator: source William? William: Sociology 101. Moderator: hahaahah William: Need my text? Moderator: Actually I'm looking for statistical information Moderator: to me a single example of man's legal oppression of women in 1894 Brittany: married womans property act of 1894 Moderator: which is Brittany: women becoming independent of the men Moderator: Britney, are you saying that by 1895 that a woman who gets divorced is to keep her own stuff? Brittany: no, but in 1894, they began to instill it, right? Moderator: The question is whether, when the story would have been written, Mrs. Mallard anyway out of a relationship like a marriage Moderator: also, there's something fundamentally different between men and women in 1894 in terms of legal rights Brittany: voting Moderator: very good Britney Moderator: so in 1894 women are not even technically citizens… William: Indeed. William: Neather were a lot of others. William: Even men. Moderator: absolutely Moderator: white men who had property were doing okay Barbara: women did not earn the right to vote until 1920 Moderator: or what else is going to be a struggle even to the 1960s Moderator: that is correct Barbara Brittany: the writer of the act was josephine henry Moderator: wow Moderator: that may or may not be helpful to you in your analysis Moderator: but it certainly is interesting Moderator: but it does bring me back to my original question Brittany: yup! Moderator: remember my original question Moderator: before we got so sidetracked Moderator: with all mostly relevant information by the way Moderator: I keep asking about Louise and Josephine because of something else which is actually my original reason for bringing up the names in the first place… where do the names Louise and Josephine get derived from Barbara: louie and joe Moderator: very good Moderator: and therefore? Barbara: lou and joseph Moderator: hahhaha Barbara: the women are an extension of the men Moderator: very good Barbara Moderator: does that fit the notion of Josephine as one who is associated with a small tyrant Moderator: the idea of Louise being a female duck… oppressed Moderator: that's the consistency I am talking about William Moderator: when the author layers and layers information that comes back to the same point… in this case, women are a subset… an oppressed subset of men Moderator: which would explain why she is so relieved to be free Moderator: if she is divorced, what does she get Brittany: nothing Moderator: if she is a widow, what does she get Barbara: everything Brittany: everything Moderator: how is a divorcee perceived in that society? Brittany: not good William: Taboo. Moderator: can you give me more specific detail Britney Moderator: why William Chris: a sin Barbara: she is not a good member of society Moderator: very good Chris Brittany: that she has done wrong Moderator: Barber, you would have to explain specifically why Moderator: exactly Britney Moderator: how is a widow perceived at that time? William: Compassion. Moderator: very good William Moderator: marriageable? Brittany: yes Moderator: Absolutely Moderator: some of these practical elements are important to understand the context in which the author creates the work. She expects that the reader of the time certainly would understand what she's talking about. The fact that over 100 years have passed since she wrote this requires that we do the research to bring us back into that in order for us to understand the conflicts in symbols inherent in the work Moderator: we have not even talked about what she did in the room Moderator: so let's talk… what did she do in the room Brittany: comfortable roomy armchair that she sank into.... her new life? Barbara: she cried Chris: cried and then realized her joy Moderator: Chris, when you look at the long quote that you gave us and look at it more closely and look for some symbolic context for what kind of freedom she's looking for Moderator: very good Britney… how does that reflect new life Moderator: Barbara, were looking for a bit more than that Moderator: unless you tell me that it's some kind of symbolic gesture Moderator: and again, were looking for symbol and irony and conflict. Brittany: shes facing an open window, so new opportunity awaits, and shes sinking into this comfortable new life William: Yoga. Or some type of prayer? Brittany: she had been pressed down by the physical exhaustion of being oppressed by her husband and now she is sinking into the chair to relax now that he is gone William: Coming to terms. Moderator: OpenWindows symbolizes what Brittany: new beginning? Moderator: William, unlikely that it is yoga William: Freedom. Chris: oportunity Brittany: new chapter?> Moderator: it share would have to be explained and then symbolized Britney Moderator: both freedom and opportunity for the open window Moderator: what is out of the open window William: Soul. Moderator: the chair would have to be explained and symbolized Britney Brittany: tops of trees aquiver with with the new spring life Moderator: William, you have to explain that. single words don't explain to me that you understand the symbol Moderator: just like Britney what Brittany: herself Moderator: again Moderator: tops of trees symbolize what Moderator: quivering symbolizes what Moderator: spring symbolizes what Brittany: trees symbolize life Moderator: keep going Britney Moderator: spring… Brittany: quivering symbolizes excitement or nervousness Moderator: very good Moderator: spring? Brittany: spring symbolizes new life being born Moderator: very good Moderator: that is an explanation\ Moderator: that shows me you understand symbols Moderator: what is going on outside of her room while she is in her room Brittany: the delicious breath of rain.... rain symbolizing the bad having been washed away Moderator: very good Britney Moderator: by the way, does rain always mean something good? Brittany: no, could also mean a stomr coming nicmball 1: no Moderator: Exactly Brittany: as in her husband coming home! Moderator: hahahaha Brittany: lol Moderator: stupid husband Brittany: yup! Moderator: is there anything in the narrative that predicts or symbolizes that this will be a short-lived freedom for her Brittany: patches of blue sky William: Yeah, the ending? Brittany: only a small amount of happiness Moderator: no William… were looking for something that foreshadows the ending Moderator: very good Britney… therefore the clouds equal what Brittany: the storm Brittany: thats brewing! Chris: the chance of rain William: Gloom. Moderator: and therefore in some ways as she looks out the window, and she sees the possibilities for this new existence, there are bits of evidence that tell us that it may not be for long Moderator: yes Brittany: yes Moderator: is there any other description within the room or out of the window Brittany: a peddler below crying his wares Moderator: what does that mean Brittany: crying his sorrows? Moderator: well, literally what does it mean Brittany: theres someone out there crying Brittany: sadness Moderator: no… what does "crying his wares" mean Moderator: literally Brittany: im not sure Moderator: you need to look this stuff up if you don't know what that means Moderator: because the author might be giving you something else to work with Moderator: and of course in this particular story, everything counts Moderator: okay… what are wares William: Commerce. Moderator: and not exactly William Moderator: he wants commerce Barbara: selling his products Moderator: yes Barbara Barbara: street vendor Moderator: that's simply what crying his wares means Moderator: yes Brittany: oh, items for sale Moderator: and indeed, he wants commerce Moderator: yes William: Selling his stuff. Moderator: exactly Moderator: William I thought you are describing what the word wares was, not the entire scene… Moderator: how is this relevant to Louise's situation, emotional position or her reality William: She needs to sell his stuff, or she will be homeless and broke? Brittany: maybe that when she's crying out in sobs, shes "selling" to others thats shes sad? Moderator: William, she's upper-class… so probably not likely Moderator: Brittany explain that context… who is she selling that idea to Moderator: and why would she need to sell that idea in the first place Brittany: as a widow, she'll want others compassion, so she sobs, selling her sadness to those around her to get compassion Moderator: but why would she need to do that\ Chris: because she insnt alone Moderator: explain Chris nicmball 1: because she's really not sad so she needs people to believe she is Brittany: so she isnt looked down upon for being glad that he is dead Chris: her husbands good friend is there William: Nicball^^ William: Indeed. Moderator: ball, Britney, Chris, I think you might be onto something Moderator: do we trust the peddler? Brittany: no Moderator: Do we trust a peddler Moderator: why not nicmball 1: no Moderator: why not nicmball 1: because they're jsut there to make a dollar Moderator: and then Brittany: because they just want to make money Moderator: and then Barbara: no because they are salespeople anxious to sell their products Chris: poof! nicmball 1: disappear Brittany: be gone Moderator: it is that second part that's important Moderator: let's face it, if you go to the Apple store they are trying to sell their products too Chris: sell the pain and get outta dodge Moderator: everybody tries to sell products… it's the essence of commerce and capitalism. Moderator: hahaah Moderator: And if the traveling sales man that carries the negative connotation Moderator: and it is generally a sales MAN Brittany: yup! Moderator: at least back then Moderator: that would certainly make sense within the context of the story… who is Louise selling this idea to Moderator: Chris, I think you mentioned it specifically Brittany: the hubbys bestie Brittany: richard Moderator: hahahaha William: Sister. Moderator: which is a better answer nicmball 1: best friend Brittany: hubbys bestie Moderator: try again Moderator: you are correct William Moderator: who is standing right outside the door Brittany: really? Brittany: the sis, thats right Moderator: in fact, I want you to look at the description of Josephine Moderator: what is she doing Moderator: and what is her position Brittany: putting her lips to the keyhole Moderator: what is she asking Louise to do Barbara: wanting to come into the room with louise Moderator: or Barbara… conversely Moderator: translate this William: Comforting Mrs. Mallard. Moderator: if Josephine wants to come into the room, what is she symbolically requesting Moderator: well William, that's the obvious… that's the literal Moderator: lets get to the symbolic Moderator: what does the room represent for Louise Barbara: to support her Brittany: her escape Moderator: and therefore what is it mean that Josephine is asking to join her nicmball 1: leave your freedom Moderator: or asking Louise to come out of the room Moderator: if she's asking what ball nicmball 1: to come out Moderator: yes Chris: she is asking to join her independance Brittany: she wants her to open the door and come out Moderator: and does she indeed as… Louise to come out William: Yeah. Brittany: yes Moderator: Chris, does Josephine want to enter the room or does she want Louise to come out William: Together. William: Come out. Brittany: come out Moderator: yes William Chris: she wants the door open Barbara: she wants her to come out William: The husband was alive.. Moderator: she does not know that William Moderator: Brentlley has not come home yet Brittany: when she finally does open the door, they go downstairs and then the hubs walks in Moderator: symbolically, she wants Louise to come out of her freedom… her isolation Moderator: that is correct Britney Moderator: folks, you must keep the story straight. You may not add or subtract anything Brittany: going down the stairs may symbolize coming back down to reality Moderator: because you'll change the translation and it will be very difficult to support Moderator: very good Britney Brittany: then she gets slapped with the reality of the hubs still being alive! Moderator: and then it's all over Barbara: and keels over! William: Death, Moderator: Josephine thinks what Moderator: when Louise is in the room Brittany: that she is sad and is making herself ill Moderator: in reality William: Celebration. nicmball 1: tears of joy Moderator: label this Brittany: deamatic irony William: Point of view. Moderator: very good Britney nicmball 1: all three Moderator: William, you'd have to explain it for me Moderator: ball, you can't throw a bunch of crap at the wall and then hope something sticks Moderator: you'd have to explain each item as you tell it to me Moderator: is there a conflict here as well Moderator: is there a symbol here as well Brittany: man vs man... josephine wants louise to come out of the room but louise doesnt want to Moderator: good nicmball 1: man vs man with josephine wanting her to come out and her not wanting to Moderator: still good Moderator: symbol? nicmball 1: symbol is josephine is trying to get her to come out of her freedom doing that means death Moderator: Very good Moderator: see how that's a much better answer than saying “all three” Moderator: hahahah Brittany: haha nicmball 1: haha i was saving all that for my essay duh! Moderator: folks, believe it or not, there's more in this story that we have discussed Moderator: that I will pretend we didn't have this conversation ball Moderator: next week we will discuss yellow wallpaper Barbara: Yeah! Moderator: don't forget that note cards/annotated works are due the 14th nicmball 1: real quick how many sources do we need for the notecards? Brittany: 10 nicmball 1: 8-10? Moderator: even if you are not doing yellow wallpaper, going through this process will help you for your paper and your final test. I would suggest that you go through the process with this Moderator: 10, ball… who the story itself, one biography, and eight analyses of the work Moderator: one is the story itself, one biography, and eight analyses of the work Moderator: yeah… what they said nicmball 1: can we have more than one biography? Moderator: any questions Moderator: there's no need ball nicmball 1: ok Moderator: and was there some reason why you need more than one biography Brittany: not right now Moderator: unless there is some reason why you need more than one biography Moderator: for those of you doing story of an hour, is a little bit clearer as to what you're going to do Moderator: ???? nicmball 1: yea Brittany: oh yes! Moderator: start writing your paper Brittany: its like every line can be disected in this story Moderator: at some point in the semester, I'm an offer an opportunity for you to calm the camp is enjoying some other people to do some pure editing. You have to have something written in order for that to make any sense Barbara: shouldnt we start with the note cards frist? Moderator: just about Britney. Certainly every scene and minor aspects of each scene can be broken down Moderator: Barbara, that's due Tuesday Moderator: the writing is next Moderator: have a good week everybody Brittany: so we have to do a peer edittoo? Moderator: yes Moderator: trust me… it'll be helpful Brittany: any idea when that will be? nicmball 1: is that required? Barbara: good night professor have a good week too. Moderator: when you've written something Moderator: thanks Barbara Moderator: yes Ball Moderator: exactly a standard for English 101 since it is the introduction of the college-level research paper Moderator: anything else Barbara: not from me Brittany: so do we do this in person with others? just asking so i know when it might be so i know for my scheduling nicmball 1: since chris and i live together can we do it that way or do we have to do it another way? Moderator: it is possible Britney. The other opportunity is to find people in the chat room or on blackboard Moderator: ball, that's up to you… it's important that you're able to help each other. You have to be honest in the analysis Brittany: ok nicmball 1: ok Brittany: have a good week! Moderator: you to Britney Chris: take care! nicmball 1: have a good night Moderator: YouTube all Moderator: U2, ball Moderator: thanks Chris Moderator: poof